Re-Cap Adjust Prison/Jail Time & Cut-off

[Copes]

-1 on changing prison sentences

+1 on more things to do in prison

I'm always up for PrisonRP but the sad reality is that prison is either pretty much empty or filled with people doing afkmath. 

Personally I think they should just remove the afk timer and keep the sentence structure the way it is.

[aXoL]

we have mentioned this problem with jail time multiple times but sadly there are so many people who haven't been into jail more than 2h so they don't understand how stupid this is to walk in the prison for 8 hours.They should cap the time to 3_4h again.

they keep saying that jail needs more rp features , so reduce the time until developers add something to play with!!!! i have met so many people who actually want criminals only into jail without any rp at all, medics heal criminals without rp when they are on the ground, cops crash into their vehicles and shot them if the chase takes more than 7_8 minutes, and our reports against cops and medics wouldn't get accepted at the exact time when the non rp happens because we are reporting against cops and medics. if you are not in a gang which has atleast 10 people online at the time you CAN NOT run from 7 cop vehicles no matter how you rp and plan.

i know people gonna come here and say: do the crime, serve the time, so im not even trying to say anything more, let them put players for 8h into the jail because they are haters even when they don't lose anything against us and only have to respawn again(if they die!).

add something to the jail or reduce the time. that's how simple it is.

Edited September 24, 2019 by aXoL

[Mopop]

Prison does need more to do. I wrote about how the stamp system needed reworked to make prison "fun" at that point it's up to the DOC. As ex-DOC I made sure I was available to RP criminals in the cells. A lot of them had neat back ground stories or were nice to talk to.

 

Though -1 to changing the sentencing there is a reason they changed it to begin with. On my crim char I got caught twice and only got an hour as each sentence because I complied and didn't run. I chose to remain silent and just did my time. We get people who start 200kmph pursuits over a freaking reckless charge, hop out on foot and start opening shots on cops...you know over a reckless driving charge.

[Dreamz]

Yeah I'd say I definitely agree with most of you. Since their isnt any real Prison Rp due to lack of activities at the least remove the AFK timer, or even add some new activities. I think personally I'd still like a 3h or less cap but still most of these opinions accurately would improve what it currently is. 

[Virus]

It’s not even about ‘Do the crime do the time’ it is a game, and nobody wants to be sat in a prison not being able to do anything worth while for 3+ hours. It’s just such a shit part of an amazing server. 

There are so many better ways to spend your time rather than sat in a prison for 5 IRL hours.

[Jasmine]

I don't mind bringing jail time down and having a cap. I agree at the end of the day this is a game and prison RP is the worst.

But they then need to GREATLY increase the financial punishment. There must be a serious repercussion to crime, especially on this server, and it needs to be severe enough that even millionaires feel it.

Flat fees, tax hike, remove welfare for XX time, or even a % of wealth should all be considered as effects of prison. Not too many people regularly spend multiple stints in prison and walk out to sports cars and mansions.

Do the crime, pay the fine.

 

[Aldarine]

-1 to a prison sentence cap. There were legitimate reasons for getting rid of the previous 2 hr cap

+1 to much more activities in prison and avenues for increased RP

[Archaeah]

Sentences were already reduced when the prison time cap was removed. 

For example reckless operation used to get 45 minutes. It is now down to 10 from a camera and 20 if you're given it from an officer. There is only one charge that gives you the old max time now whereas multiple used to give 120 minutes. 

You really need to get multiple charges at once to be getting very high sentences.

 

Prison times are also often reduced if you display good RP during the arrest which can take a chunk out of your overall sentence.

 

+1 to more things to do in prison, however there is also nothing stopping prisoners from RPing with each other their own RP without needing scripting.

[CaesarSeizure]

I have to agree with @Jasmine here about increasing the financial penalty if you want reduced sentences.

I think maybe even give people the option, either pay with money or pay with time, but it has to be a penalty one way or the other.

 

+1 on more things to do, because why not. 

[Balastas]

56 minutes ago, Archaeah said:

Prison times are also often reduced if you display good RP during the arrest which can take a chunk out of your overall sentence.

Laughs in fake news, been there, been PD only friends of friends gets lower sentences or if police officer is really reasonable, if you dont have friends oh well you were in a shootout with pd, oh well man you're getting 5x attempted murder of gov. employee.
Problem is that criminals here never win, if you get caught by police you get a severe punishment if you kill pd officer he doesn't lose anything. Criminals even make less cash than farmers the only thing to be criminal that it's fun if we keep it irl criminals should be rich from making drugs n shit.
Yes we should keep this realistic, but to punish person for 5 hours in prison where there is nothing to do is bullshit.

Edited September 24, 2019 by Balastas

[Dreamz]

15 minutes ago, Balastas said:

Laughs in fake news, been there, been PD only friends of friends gets lower sentences or if police officer is really reasonable, if you dont have friends oh well you were in a shootout with pd, oh well man you're getting 5x attempted murder of gov. employee.
Problem is that criminals here never win, if you get caught by police you get a severe punishment if you kill pd officer he doesn't lose anything. Criminals even make less cash than farmers the only thing to be criminal that it's fun if we keep it irl criminals should be rich from making drugs n shit.
Yes we should keep this realistic, but to punish person for 5 hours in prison where there is nothing to do is bullshit.

Extremely accurate...

[aXoL]

12 minutes ago, Balastas said:

Laughs in fake news, been there, been PD only friends of friends gets lower sentences or if police officer is really reasonable, if you dont have friends oh well you were in a shootout with pd, oh well man you're getting 5x attempted murder of gov. employee.
Problem is that criminals here never win, if you get caught by police you get a severe punishment if you kill pd officer he doesn't lose anything. Criminals even make less cash than farmers the only thing to be criminal that it's fun if we keep it irl criminals should be rich from making drugs n shit.
Yes we should keep this realistic, but to punish person for 5 hours in prison where there is nothing to do is bullshit.

that is what i am saying bro, but i dont know why admins dont listen to us.

[AtwellMP]

-1  For reducing sentence times. Although I feel like its a little long to spend for doing Crim RP which in itself is already risky enough since every way to make money can end you up in there for a while. It is a punishment for doing things illegally and therefore shouldn't be taken as lightly since people wouldn't fear going to jail and would be more risky with crimes.

There should be alternatives for when you're in there to make it feel better for CrimRP

+1 Adding more things to do would be great, the poker was a cool installment but no one is ever playing it, mining is a grind for not a whole lot of payoff. I'm not a developer by any means and I'm unsure of whats capable but having jobs in prison we can do to reduce our sentence and/or make money. Another idea I got from @Shorty is to add Solitary Confinement for those who just want to AFK their prison sentence and by doing so the AFK Math script would need to be removed from the prison. Prison could be a place where you go and could potentially meet other gangs and possibly get recruited. Final idea for it would be being able to get contraband and getting a Shiv or something like that to stage a breakout.

 

[thiggins19]

On 9/23/2019 at 10:58 PM, aXoL said:

we have mentioned this problem with jail time multiple times but sadly there are so many people who haven't been into jail more than 2h so they don't understand how stupid this is to walk in the prison for 8 hours.They should cap the time to 3_4h again.

they keep saying that jail needs more rp features , so reduce the time until developers add something to play with!!!! i have met so many people who actually want criminals only into jail without any rp at all, medics heal criminals without rp when they are on the ground, cops crash into their vehicles and shot them if the chase takes more than 7_8 minutes, and our reports against cops and medics wouldn't get accepted at the exact time when the non rp happens because we are reporting against cops and medics. if you are not in a gang which has atleast 10 people online at the time you CAN NOT run from 7 cop vehicles no matter how you rp and plan.

i know people gonna come here and say: do the crime, serve the time, so im not even trying to say anything more, let them put players for 8h into the jail because they are haters even when they don't lose anything against us and only have to respawn again(if they die!).

add something to the jail or reduce the time. that's how simple it is.

I'm curious as to what medics are doing this to you? We can do stabilize anim without RP, but can't move on to the next person without finishing RP with the first person, than we can /heal. If you see medics doing this different feel free to DM me as this goes against our internal and OOC rules. 

[AtwellMP]

17 minutes ago, thiggins19 said:

I'm curious as to what medics are doing this to you? We can do stabilize anim without RP, but can't move on to the next person without finishing RP with the first person, than we can /heal. If you see medics doing this different feel free to DM me as this goes against our internal and OOC rules. 

I’ve seen this happen where a guy is on the brink of death and is gonna do death RP, then the medic will run up and stabilize without RP to prevent that 

[Copperhorse]

Remove the afk timer. If you have a 4 hour sentence you have the option of just sleeping (afking) in your jail cell until it's over.

[thiggins19]

1 hour ago, AtwellMP said:

I’ve seen this happen where a guy is on the brink of death and is gonna do death RP, then the medic will run up and stabilize without RP to prevent that 

So, we haven't PG'd anything. We are allowed to run up and /stabilize without RP. What we can't do is /heal without RP. We also can't /stabilize and run to the next person.

[AtwellMP]

19 minutes ago, thiggins19 said:

So, we haven't PG'd anything. We are allowed to run up and /stabilize without RP. What we can't do is /heal without RP. We also can't /stabilize and run to the next person.

Ahh okay, I appreciate you clearing that up for me

 

[thiggins19]

53 minutes ago, AtwellMP said:

Ahh okay, I appreciate you clearing that up for me

 

Also, just because you're stabilized, doesn't mean you don't get DeathRP. Stabilization just makes it so if they grant you DeathRP it's because you RP'd really good. Normally we don't even know who has DeathRP so that's why we try to just stabilize and begin treatment, normally get told after someone asks.

[Bala]

I've been debating whether to make this or not, as often these kind of threads end up with people taking sides rather than discussing the suggestion or issue.
But I feel quite strongly about it so I thought I would say something.

The Problem

I was pro-uncap back when this was first suggested, for a number of reasons. I felt that it would lend weight to people committing crimes, I thought that it would add weight to investigations and I thought it would lead to a better role-play standard and subconsciously, I probably just wanted to fuck over the criminals. I was adamant that this would be for the best.

Now, we're a number of months on and even with more or less the same amount of players. The criminals haven't had a real criminal update for quite a while but as I'm not a criminal, I'd like to discuss my perspective as a cop. I feel that the excitement and unpredictability that makes being a cop on role-play servers has been significantly reduced. 

There is significant periods of time where there is little to no 911 calls for police. We're now in an environment where we have TWO law enforcement factions and between them they have around 140 people in them, but I don't feel that there is enough to do to keep them entertained. There is only so much passive role-play that you can do, only so many streets that you can patrol before you feel like it's groundhog day. We're getting too many units constantly responding to calls when they do come in because they've spent the last 10-15 minutes doing nothing.

For me, I log on to be entertained. I love the 'anything can happen' nature of being a cop and even now when the brown stuff hits the fan, I think to myself, that was good. Win or lose. But it's not just about shootouts and pursuits. Crime is the currency of being a police officer in Eclipse and plenty more crime does also bring plenty more role-play.

People talk about the cops and robbers trope but there isn't really anywhere near the same level of interest or support for civilian roleplay, for the most part you are either a bad guy criminal or you are a good guy cop. That is the foundation for GTA roleplay servers before now, currently and will be in the future. Ask yourself, who is the main enemy for the Zetas and the Triads? The cops. Who is the main enemy for the cops, The Zetas and The Triads. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that either.

We also have the problem of the prison times themselves. The idea of uncapping the prison times is that it would push more people to role-play in prison. DOC, has it done that? It seems to me we have a massive prison interior and every time i've been there, I can count the amount of inmates on one hand. We have at least 20 cells!

Let's be honest, if someone has a long sentence in prison, how much % of the time do they spend role-playing? I've heard stories of people watching Netflix while in prison and just tabbing in to beat the AFK timer. Who does that really help? Doesn't help the people in prison, doesn't help the guards of DOC. All it does is lock people in an area of the map for an extended period of time.

Mission Row/Paleto Station jails aren't conducive to roleplay either. You are locked in a 5x5 cell for the duration of your sentence and that's it.

Finally, there is also the mentality of people facing prison. This I think is where the biggest problem lies. We've gone from not enough of a deterrent to too much of one. We still get some crime, yes, but it's not enough to sustain two PDs with a player base of 200-250. Whether it's the reality or not, the perception of cops is that we're stack happy on the charges and want to fuck you over with the amount of time you're going to serve. The idea of a limitless amount of prison time also fuels the notion that cops have unchecked power and can throw you in prison for as long as you want. Most people still go to prison for less than the two hour cap we had before but a lot of this problem is about the lack of trust criminals have in the PD OOC. If they have a limit, they know at the very least they'll do x time.

Otherwise it seems to often provoke one of two responses, either the criminal decides that it's not worth committing crimes hardly at all because of the punishment OR more toxic, they become more and more unreasonable OOC and try to make situations are difficult as possible to resolve. Ultimately, I feel that prison sentences should not be a crutch to hold up the role-play standard of criminals, that's for the rules and the players themselves to self-enforce.

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My Solutions

• I would like to see the threshold of going to prison be reduced from 45 minutes to 30 minutes. This adds a little more travel time to a cop's shift, but ultimately it's going to allow more people to role-play while incarcerated, which in turn is going to help both DOC and the other inmates. However, VIP would take less of a percentage off sentences less than 45 minutes to cover the transport and processing time.
   
• I would also like to suggest re-capping prison times back at 120 minutes (2 hours) with the option for High Command of PD/SD/Commissioner to be able to adjust the cap.
   
  The High Command of the Police Departments or the Commissioner would be able to raise the cap in-game if there were certain circumstances i.e. a significant investigation into an individual that outweighed the time they were going to get or an individual with specific charges on their account pending.
  
  This is very dependent on the charges they have. If someone has murdered 3 people, that's 180 minutes and really, it's one of the most serious crimes and deserves serious punishment in kind. Crime should mean something but not at the expense of not being worth it for the criminals to commit it at all. 
  
  But for example if someone has a combination of the lesser more common crimes like 1x Armed Robbery, 1x Felony Evading and Carrying an Unlicensed Firearm.. that's 150 minutes right now and they're actually pretty common charges and also, victim less crimes if they use their vehicle and rob a store. I don't think you need more than two hours for that, at all.
  
  This suggestion re-encourages some of the low-level/mid-level crime but still allows for a clamp down on the serious stuff.
   
• Fines however would not be capped so persistent offenders would still get punished and there would still be significant financial cost to the criminal for getting caught. This would hurt some criminals more than others, clearly.

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At the end of the day, we all just want to jump on, have some good roleplay and enjoy ourselves. There has to be consequences for actions, but I just feel like being a little more lenient on those consequences will lead to a better balance and a more harmonious environment for everyone that plays.

[MrSilky]

Big plus one here.

I agree that you need to have consequences for your actions in game, but hitting someone with a OOC 5 hour sentence plus to ruin their night is not the way forward. I used to argue that prison times should be uncapped but after playing for many months with the cap, both cop and criminal RP has severely slowed down and become somewhat stagnant.

[UndeaddWarrior]

Big +1

I've had to sit in jail for over 10 hours before and its not pleasant. I feel as there should be a cap of about 4 or so hours max, maybe even less.

[Will215]

37 minutes ago, GOAT said:

The High Command of the Police Departments or the Commissioner would be able to raise the cap in-game if there were certain circumstances i.e. a significant investigation into an individual that outweighed the time they were going to get or an individual with specific charges on their account pending.

Big +1. I think people getting charge stacked with 4x Accessory to Murder of an LEO and getting 180 minutes off solely that is a little bit overkill, and these people could have never fired a shot in the whole fight. If PD High Command has the ability to give charge length based on the conduct that they have observed, I would definitely support the cap being put back on.

[AEEKAY]

Huge +1

[dawpi]

All I can do is bow to the creator of this server suggestion. I believe we have discussed this on discord days or weeks ago, however, I still stand behind all what is being suggested. It is very fun to stack charges to someone from someone who may be corrupt and the guy has to spend half of his playtime in jail dealing with it which I find to be necessary. Of course, that jail time cap would bring back all of it again "put as many charges as you want, I'll be in jail for 120 days", however, I would rather be in that environment where some action happens and people are not afraid to develop their criminal characters while doing some criminal stuff AND not being afraid of having to sit in jail for 700 minutes as it would be capped lets say at 120 minutes. +1.