Law Enforcement Discussion

[MrSilky]

2 minutes ago, Ezrya said:

The problem with this is it would require me literally asking every officer I see using /pw to get ammo or armour if they have RP proof of placing extra ammo into their cruisers and would require officers constantly screenshotting putting extra ammo into their cruisers. Wouldn't it be better to just scriptly limit the amount of times an officer can use /pw from a cruiser and once their limited amount of uses run out they have to go back to one of the stations across the map to refill.

I think that's a fair way to look at it. Means that the cruiser isn't a rolling armoury and still allows for extra supplies RP.

3 minutes ago, Ezrya said:

Your most definetly right here I can admit I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to the OOC rules law enforcement factions have to follow as I'm not in any law enforcement factions, a suggestion for this would be for law enforcement factions to have more clarity and maybe announce any rule changes made to their OOC policies given PD is probably one of the biggest and most infuential factions on the server because personally I just don't see this heavily monitored PD when I see half the stuff they do. Just like I said in my comment there is a lot PD and SD can improve and good suggestions that come from these threads that could possibly be implemented rather than law enforcement players just coming in here like "jUsT pLaY sMaRtEr". The responses that have come from PD players on this thread are the reason why there's so much OOC tension between criminal and law enforcement factions. I know that at least from the criminal factions I have been in, a lot of suggestions that come from FM and PD are actually impemented ranging from needing permission from higherups to engage in shootouts with PD/SD to limit the amount of shootouts that happen to limiting the amount of people chasing cars through a city and that's just a few examples.

I agree with you here too. But those comments on this thread were directed to the people blindly saying "PD is overpowered" without considering both sides (crims with supers, businesses, IC rules for PD, crim & PD mindset for action RP over RP etc etc).

[Cyrus Raven]

25 minutes ago, Ezrya said:

The problem with this is it would require me literally asking every officer I see using /pw to get ammo or armour if they have RP proof of placing extra ammo into their cruisers and would require officers constantly screenshotting putting extra ammo into their cruisers. Wouldn't it be better to just scriptly limit the amount of times an officer can use /pw from a cruiser and once their limited amount of uses run out they have to go back to one of the stations across the map to refill.

 

Your most definetly right here I can admit I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to the OOC rules law enforcement factions have to follow as I'm not in any law enforcement factions, a suggestion for this would be for law enforcement factions to have more clarity and maybe announce any rule changes made to their OOC policies given PD is probably one of the biggest and most infuential factions on the server because personally I just don't see this heavily monitored PD when I see half the stuff they do. Just like I said in my comment there is a lot PD and SD can improve and good suggestions that come from these threads that could possibly be implemented rather than law enforcement players just coming in here like "jUsT pLaY sMaRtEr". The responses that have come from PD players on this thread are the reason why there's so much OOC tension between criminal and law enforcement factions. I know that at least from the criminal factions I have been in, a lot of suggestions that come from FM and PD are actually impemented ranging from needing permission from higherups to engage in shootouts with PD/SD to limit the amount of shootouts that happen to limiting the amount of people chasing cars through a city and that's just a few examples.

I'm not trying to make tensions between crims and PD/SD worse. But these suggestions need to be outlined in a lot better light, the reason these convos become a big back and forth of ''no you're wrong, no I'm right'' etc... is because there isn't any concrete examples or evidence being given on either side. Most if not all of the comments I saw here regarding script changes and QoL improvements I agree with, like the /pw comment, until the script changes we will have to continue RP'ing taking weapons and extra vests to our vehicles, you can, at any point, ask an Officer you see using a heavy weapon for RP proof, it might take a while to get it depending on the circumstance, but in theory they should all have it, if they don't then that is them breaking an OOC protocol. 

Same applies to the bank alarm suggestion, being able to do a certain part in a stealth way, maybe with a mini-game like GTA Online. Giving you guys a better system to acquire weapons probably wouldn't be bad either, etc...

However, I think it is fair that criminals also realise that some of their actions could improve. I don't think people should be surprised for getting reckless when speeding past cops in the city at 200km/h, I don't think people should be surprised to get IDd when having a gun on their waist while wearing a mask or being a known criminal. I also don't think most actions that are inherently IC should be complained about, they should adapted to. BUT, I am also 100% in support of a legal system and beyond that a actual involved government where people have a voice instead of the way it works right now, because then these complaints can actually be addressed IC'ly. I understand that as it stands right now, the only real way to change an IC protocol is essentially to complain OOC'ly because of the lack of recourse to fix these IC'ly.

Edited July 1, 2020 by Kyle White Raven

[Cyrus Raven]

8 minutes ago, Hoxton_Curry said:

What kind of server are you playing..?

I thought it was a hardcore RP server, but the way some people are talking I can only assume they think they are in a cops and robbers server.

[Riderz]

1 hour ago, NM369 said:

A random person showing up to a shootout shouldn't have the right to deny your deathRP, It's just extremely arrogant to judge others RP just because you think you might think you have "higher RP standards". During wars deathRP never got granted and you saw the outcome, Lots of higher ups got killed off rather quickly and some refused to even get in game because of this. Why should it be diffrent for LEOs? DeathRP requires a rework. 

I personally barely interact with any LEO's or ever require deathRP but it's not fair to others. 

 

 

If you'd like that in your own factors would the same not apply gang v gang/ player v objects? Like for example getting shot in the chest with a shotgun, you should not be carried to a hospital or be CPR'd since RPLY you would be very much dead? Can't call the medics since you would be so injured you could not find the energy to even raise the phone for example. The re-work suggested would need to factor all cases of injury for example hitting your motorbike into a pole at 170km. In that particular case you would be so beaten by the impact of force more then likely could not even muster the air to speak into a radio requesting aid. 

[UrbanAwsomeman]

Tezhi makes a good point. I would be all for criminals getting more deathRP but in return they have to let gang members die in gang v gang shootouts. Because i've seen people get sprayed down by a swat member just for their buddy to come over slap a gauze with a /me and then /cpr which is frankly piss poor RP. If you guys want realism in PD shootouts I want it in every injury.

[TheCactus]

5 hours ago, Ezrya said:

The problem with this is it would require me literally asking every officer I see using /pw to get ammo or armour if they have RP proof of placing extra ammo into their cruisers and would require officers constantly screenshotting putting extra ammo into their cruisers. Wouldn't it be better to just scriptly limit the amount of times an officer can use /pw from a cruiser and once their limited amount of uses run out they have to go back to one of the stations across the map to refill.

 

Your most definetly right here I can admit I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to the OOC rules law enforcement factions have to follow as I'm not in any law enforcement factions, a suggestion for this would be for law enforcement factions to have more clarity and maybe announce any rule changes made to their OOC policies given PD is probably one of the biggest and most infuential factions on the server because personally I just don't see this heavily monitored PD when I see half the stuff they do. Just like I said in my comment there is a lot PD and SD can improve and good suggestions that come from these threads that could possibly be implemented rather than law enforcement players just coming in here like "jUsT pLaY sMaRtEr". The responses that have come from PD players on this thread are the reason why there's so much OOC tension between criminal and law enforcement factions. I know that at least from the criminal factions I have been in, a lot of suggestions that come from FM and PD are actually impemented ranging from needing permission from higherups to engage in shootouts with PD/SD to limit the amount of shootouts that happen to limiting the amount of people chasing cars through a city and that's just a few examples.

I kind of agree with most of the above. I see a lot of people just CTRL+D (to go on duty) and pull out an M4 from their cruisers just by doing /pw while I spend around 3 minutes to grab the stuff from the armory, lock it in my cruiser and slide an additional vest under the seat. Now I don't expect you to RP picking up every single mag but if you jumped into the cruiser without a heavy weapon, you don't have it.

[Machete]

7 hours ago, Tezhl said:

If you'd like that in your own factors would the same not apply gang v gang/ player v objects? Like for example getting shot in the chest with a shotgun, you should not be carried to a hospital or be CPR'd since RPLY you would be very much dead? Can't call the medics since you would be so injured you could not find the energy to even raise the phone for example. The re-work suggested would need to factor all cases of injury for example hitting your motorbike into a pole at 170km. In that particular case you would be so beaten by the impact of force more then likely could not even muster the air to speak into a radio requesting aid. 

I would suggest new bleedout timers, If you clap yourself from a faggio while driving 20Km/h you shouldnt die as fast as you'd have gotten shot. If you'd have no wounds in /analysewounds you should die at a 0.25 rate for example or if you got shot at a 4X rate depending on the amount of wounds. People would make way smarter choises and fear more for their lives. Personally I think this would make the server better. Also /cpr should be like a /stabilize because there will be a cooldown. 

[Serthon]

3 minutes ago, NM369 said:

I would suggest new bleedout timers, If you clap yourself from a faggio while driving 20Km/h you shouldnt die as fast as you'd have gotten shot. If you'd have no wounds in /analysewounds you should die at a 0.25 rate for example or if you got shot at a 4X rate depending on the amount of wounds. People would make way smarter choises and fear more for their lives. Personally I think this would make the server better. Also /cpr should be like a /stabilize because there will be a cooldown. 

I think that's a wonderful idea. Please create a server suggestion for it.

[Gekko]

This is not PD nor Criminals fault to be honest, the server been working from a beginning not to have fun but to grind and win situations and I have seen it from both sides.

PD truthfully does not want to have fun rather to win situations and you can hear that in TAC situations where when you lose someone there will be remarks like "ughh" and so on. I know there is a lack of training in the PD as well, officers rushing criminals for no reason while they have AK47 in their hands, pursuits are sometimes just a shit show and the most importantly to punish people as hard as you can, that is their mentality. Do I blame them for this? No, that's how server/admins and people in high positions let it go for ages.

Although this is not one sided thing as well, Criminals does the same things, they tend even to break the rules because lets be real you're rp'ing a gang member, YOU ARE EXPECTED to run away from police, not to snitch and so and so on but tht will result in loads shit of fines + jail time therefore lets be serious there won't be fun interactions where the border line is that you will be jailed for 6 hours. Criminals tend to as well overpower their caracters while they're cuffed on the ground they "roll away" in a second and jump in friends car, people trying to help their friends while irl noone drives up to you just to say "get in".

My point is that this is not PD nor Criminals problem, this is EVERYONES problem, everyone is at fault, server been operating like that for ages where you had to win, not to have fun, noone is trying to create fun RP for the other side and so on. But I still have some hope that one day people will actually want to Roleplay and you will hear laughter from broken characters as well as dropping "I must win" situation.

[Tayven]

On 6/28/2020 at 2:20 AM, Tucccci said:

Smart criminal do not look like criminals.

 

Disagree, for instance you're telling me a crip or a blood doesn't walk around there neighborhood with there red or blue flag on them? Or something that indicates that they're a blood / crip ?

On 6/28/2020 at 2:20 AM, Tucccci said:

Smart criminals don't hangout in the exact same spot everyday doing the exact same illegal shit.

 

In fact this is false, maybe you live that suburban lifestyle and never seen a corner thats ran by known gang members, or even a whole neighborhood that's ran by gang members, they actually protect they're illegal spot everyday  

 

On 6/28/2020 at 2:20 AM, Tucccci said:

But from some who is not proud of the criminal I once was(IRL),You are not using your tools. Watching some of the criminals fail to generate an alibi or even a semi believable lie (when these are supposed to be gang lords and what not) Is like watching a police officer not using his handcuffs or not know how to use the radio. 

 

I strongly doubt this is true. Maybe a petty criminal full of misdemeanors.

[Marca]

I find it a bit weird when people try to argue how real life gangs work. Real life gangs show their colors, yes they even paint their cars to match the color. However they interact way differently with law enforcement than gangs do on ECRP. 

Gangs IRL avoid cops as much as possible. They put a lot of effort in tracking police, marked or unmarked, when they enter their territory and alert their sellers to move if cops are getting close. They don't alert just their sellers, but everyone that's currently out and about doing anything illegal. Sometimes they'll get busted and what will their fellow gang members do? Nothing because they know better and go away. A mule or a normal rank member is not worth protecting from cops, because if they would shoot at the cops, they would get a massive police response. The consequences would be random stop and frisks, more police patrols, home raids and other things that would disrupt their operations. Even if the cops would arrest a lieutenant in the gang, it would likely go smoothly for the police. Again, they know the consequences would not be worth it.

If something does happen, gang members will lay low as much as possible to avoid cops. They'll drop the colors in public and operate in the shadows only. Once a gang is suppressed by law enforcement, rival gangs tend to move into their territory and that's when trouble starts. Shootouts don't last as long and if cops are on their way, they'll run because risking jail would not be worth it. Often you see people in ECRP hold their ground while they can easily escape, which is foolish. 

As a final note, people should stop competing with law enforcement or try to make it an even playing field. There has to be some force on the server that will react severely enough so people think twice before going against them, else there's just chaos all around. Remember, this is a RP server and I'm surprised how lenient people are when it comes to things like murder charges. You wouldn't do that IRL because you'd get locked up for life in prison if you had 10+ murders on your hands.

Maybe one day our characters deaths will count towards something and making the game a bit more hardcore. Currently I don't feel like the game punishes you that much if you die. It's more of a boring inconvenience rather than a punishment.

[Itzsonzy]

2 minutes ago, Marca said:

I find it a bit weird when people try to argue how real life gangs work. Real life gangs show their colors, yes they even paint their cars to match the color. However they interact way differently with law enforcement than gangs do on ECRP. 

Gangs IRL avoid cops as much as possible. They put a lot of effort in tracking police, marked or unmarked, when they enter their territory and alert their sellers to move if cops are getting close. They don't alert just their sellers, but everyone that's currently out and about doing anything illegal. Sometimes they'll get busted and what will their fellow gang members do? Nothing because they know better and go away. A mule or a normal rank member is not worth protecting from cops, because if they would shoot at the cops, they would get a massive police response. The consequences would be random stop and frisks, more police patrols, home raids and other things that would disrupt their operations. Even if the cops would arrest a lieutenant in the gang, it would likely go smoothly for the police. Again, they know the consequences would not be worth it.

If something does happen, gang members will lay low as much as possible to avoid cops. They'll drop the colors in public and operate in the shadows only. Once a gang is suppressed by law enforcement, rival gangs tend to move into their territory and that's when trouble starts. Shootouts don't last as long and if cops are on their way, they'll run because risking jail would not be worth it. Often you see people in ECRP hold their ground while they can easily escape, which is foolish. 

As a final note, people should stop competing with law enforcement or try to make it an even playing field. There has to be some force on the server that will react severely enough so people think twice before going against them, else there's just chaos all around. Remember, this is a RP server and I'm surprised how lenient people are when it comes to things like murder charges. You wouldn't do that IRL because you'd get locked up for life in prison if you had 10+ murders on your hands.

Maybe one day our characters deaths will count towards something and making the game a bit more hardcore. Currently I don't feel like the game punishes you that much if you die. It's more of a boring inconvenience rather than a punishment.

Lenient? lil bro make a crim character and sit in prison for 6 hours.

[Marca]

2 minutes ago, Itzsonzy said:

Lenient? lil bro make a crim character and sit in prison for 6 hours.

Do you want me to sit in jail for 6 hours because that's how it usually is or because of your poor decisions that got you those 6 hours of prison? I guess here's the difference in how people play, because I'd personally consider if my action would be worth it even if I failed. You'd be surprised how often people push their luck and just make things worse for themselves, then blame it on everyone and everything else but themselves.

I doubt you got those 6 hours because of someone else's fault or because the officer felt like it, honestly, you got it because you made those decisions. It's like saying that it's the casinos fault for making you spend all your money on the slot machines, while it was entirely your decision to do it. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

[Ezrya]

Just now, Marca said:

Do you want me to sit in jail for 6 hours because that's how it usually is or because of your poor decisions that got you those 6 hours of prison? I guess here's the difference in how people play, because I'd personally consider if my action would be worth it even if I failed. You'd be surprised how often people push their luck and just make things worse for themselves, then blame it on everyone and everything else but themselves.

I doubt you got those 6 hours because of someone else's fault or because the officer felt like it, honestly, you got it because you made those decisions. It's like saying that it's the casinos fault for making you spend all your money on the slot machines, while it was entirely your decision to do it. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

You can actually get 6 hours because of someone else's fault or because the officer did feel like it. Things aren't always in your control when you play crim. Plus it's really easy to just sit there and talk about actions having more consequences when you play PD where your actions literally have 0 consequences, when you can just run into heavily armed criminals completely outnumbered and just spawn back at MD, grab another cruiser and just go back on patrol. If you think doing 6 hours in prison is ok then you have never done it.

[Marca]

2 minutes ago, Ezrya said:

You can actually get 6 hours because of someone else's fault or because the officer did feel like it. Things aren't always in your control when you play crim. Plus it's really easy to just sit there and talk about actions having more consequences when you play PD where your actions literally have 0 consequences, when you can just run into heavily armed criminals completely outnumbered and just spawn back at MD, grab another cruiser and just go back on patrol. If you think doing 6 hours in prison is ok then you have never done it.

I guess I should point out that I am currently not active on the server, so my view simply comes from common sense and how I usually play games. My way of playing was always to be careful and I never really did rush into anything. I could count my deaths with my fingers and would still have some left over, from what I remember at least. My last death was when I misjudged a situation and was told incorrect information regarding it, which was quite some time ago and it's been a while since my death before that one. So no, my way of playing was to spare my characters life rather than yoloing into situations if I had any doubt about my survival.

Never said 6 hours was fun in prison, however that is a different issue and topic on how to make the prison more enjoyable. About officers throwing every single book at you, if they didn't add any false charges on you, they cannot be blamed because they refused to go easy on you. But I'd argue that's an IC issue, along with it being someone else's fault, like your friends. A similar example can be given about criminals, when they choose to steal everything from their victim, including the phone battery. They don't really have to take literally everything, but they have the option to. This also would be an IC issue.

[Flucifial]

+1 on lootable weapons and locker room limits.

 

-1 on shorter prison sentences and legal faction member limits (Criminals used to outnumber law enforcement, now it's the opposite which is how it should be in my opinion.)

[Gekko]

6 hours ago, Flucifial said:

+1 on lootable weapons and locker room limits.

 

-1 on shorter prison sentences and legal faction member limits (Criminals used to outnumber law enforcement, now it's the opposite which is how it should be in my opinion.)

I agree on that but what lootable weapons would lead to if caught? massive jail time? their house raid? There should be a punishment for taking a cop gun in the first place cuz people would make PD officers walking drops.

Because if someone would find a PD riffle on guy shooting at cops, oh boy oh boy to be in fact loads of gangs got raided by SWAT just cuz they killed one or two police officers.


I actually think the main problem is that criminals can't function without shadow currency, everything is related to your bank, cash is not important as if, there's no way to go indebt while actually have millions in your possesion. Believe me there's loads of even billionairs working in such way that has nothing in their "possesion" apart shadow money.

[Tucccci]

18 hours ago, Tayven said:

Disagree, for instance you're telling me a crip or a blood doesn't walk around there neighborhood with there red or blue flag on them? Or something that indicates that they're a blood / crip ?

In fact this is false, maybe you live that suburban lifestyle and never seen a corner that's ran by known gang members, or even a whole neighborhood that's ran by gang members, they actually protect they're illegal spot everyday  

 

I'm not saying those aren't good representations of american criminal life,What I am saying is low level flag wavers get A LOT of police attention, So when i hear someone complain" waaaaahhhh i got pulled over for no reason" Welcome to gang life son. You got priors? hang out on the block all you want,but best believe 12 is gonna be checking in if they see you got warrants. 

It is actually hilarious that the massive amount of jail one can encounter STILL is not enough to make criminals think up even a quarter baked semi operational plan to accomplish a crime. they then EXTREMELY predictably get arrested, and then fumble around with an alibi like a toddler with a buzzsaw. then,feeling defeated by the INTENSE lack of foresight or planning,they come to the forums,or complain in /b about how "we should have shorter jail times! that way we could commit our half-baked boondoggles more often!"

IRL plenty of bangers see prison time as a mark of honor. Maybe criminal factions could reward prison time somehow?

The idea that you would climb the ranks of a street gang without doing serious time seems unlikely to me,not sure how things are these days but OG's used to be able to run things from inside prison.

And most of all,I don't think a street gang is a smart criminal enterprise,and therefor criminals within it are just not smart criminals. That's just my opinion based on the fact that i don't like being in jail. So i understand if you feel like the thug life is worth the jail time,i'm sure plenty of people do.

[Freclan]

7 hours ago, artyon said:

HUGE +1 but i feel like instend of really nerfing PD , it would be better to Buff crim. Make the cap on faction gangs more then 40 maybe 60 or even 80 (as u said pd and sd togehter have over 300 people that is not fair for criminals cuz if everyone was on from lets say the triads and all from PD and SD it would be a 40 vs 300 + PD and SD as u said urself have free guns as well as kevlar ) I think they should definitly add a future to PD and SD where or crims can take their weapons or that they lose money per shotgun they take out from their factions tresury. i dont think its fair crims need to spend over 20+ k to get a shotgun just to fight a PD who has a shotgun AND bodyarmour for free its no really reaslistic cuz IRL pd and sd dont have unlimited guns and bodyarmours and they dont get it for free. But instend of nerfing PD heavily i would say nerf PD slightly and buff Crim slighly, lets say for crim up the cap for criminal facitions from 40 to ATLEAST 60 and add more future for us to make money (ATM robberies soon i know its been announced but its takin a long time ??) and make PD lose money or let crims take guns from PD , as well as nerfing the police cruiser a bit by making it less faster or maybe just so Cruiser cant ram, like u stated that a CRUISE small little cruiser can ram the fuck out of a kamacho, it does not seem realistic AT ALL. 

Have you read anything in this thread?

[Donovan]

I believe the simplest and easiest way to make both PD/SD/SADOC more realistic and " nerf " them is to just make people pay for their inventory.

---

Now what do I mean by that, well as it is done IRL both cruisers and weaponary is signed out by an individual when taken out of the weaponary inside the precinct, so the change I would be really happy with both RP and Gameplay wise and I am pretty sure most would agree is to assign a monetary value to both vehicle and guns/ammo which would be payed for from their SALARY ( IE: If you are about to be paid 100k at the end of the week, removing the cost of Crown Vic + Carbine + ammo you end up with 50k  for example obviously numbers are a subject to change but its clear enough for example which means if you haven't earned enough money through salary aka playing the game, you cannot just log in once a week and take a carbine and a super car out unless you are high rank ie: high command+ which all this wouldnt apply to)

---

For example : On the first time when I take a vehicle as a member of PD during a week ( When salaries roll out ) depending on the vehicle of choice I pay a certain amount of money for it ( Look at it as leasing/renting a vehicle ) so for the argument sake let's say Crown Vic costs 40.000$ and make it so every time I " spawn " in crown vic it will be that specific one and in the same condition as it was when I have parked it ( same fuel, same state visually and same state engine wise )

What is the point of it? Well quite easily it will make people do several things :
1) Value their vehicle as they will have to repair it and refuel it making both their driving regularly and in pursuits different as every time they'd flip bcs they would go for an insane ram or go in a turn 200 km/h and slam into a wall they would be losing money out of their pocket

2)  As vehicles wont be free, the swaps of vehicles will be lower and departments inside PD will be considerably more distinct both RP and gameplay wise as you wouldn't see high rank members taking cars/vehicles as they please and parking them 10 minutes later to take a new one

Same goes for weaponary and I will list examples bellow as how it would work :

Taking a Carbine out would cost 10.000$ with every 100 rounds costing the same amount of money criminals pay for their ammunation ( STOCK PRICE ) so in this case Carbine ammo = AK ammo price wise.

With this introduction, it would not only make people carry less weapons around with them, but also selectively use them and not for example use a carbine for every situation, or spray 100 bullets when 10-20 are needed with a bit of a smarter playstyle.

---

At the end of a shift both weapon and vehicle are remembered to the specific character and every time they'd take that weaponary out in the same week they wouldn't pay a fee but they wouldn't be able to obtain a fresh vehicle/new carbine but would need to take more ammo from weaponary inside precinct ( which they'd pay for ) and repair a vehicle inside LSC/Bayview back to its original state.
 

---

I am prepared for people to disagree with me but I am pretty sure that many would see this as a very nice way to both increase and highly differentiate RP inside PD/SD/SADOC and divisions inside each of them and at the same time " nerf " both the mentality and playstyle of legal factions.

ps: i am typing this in a rush so grammar mistakes are possible, if somehow this idea goes through I will be more than happy to make a more detailed post on how everything would work and explain my idea in depth.

Edited July 4, 2020 by Donovan

[Freclan]

41 minutes ago, Donovan said:

I believe the simplest and easiest way to make both PD/SD/SADOC more realistic and " nerf " them is to just make people pay for their inventory.

All the equipment PD use is government funded, why should we have to pay for it out of our own pocket? We can't use the equipment off shift and we definitely can't use the equipment for half the shit criminals get to use guns and cars for

[Cyrus Raven]

58 minutes ago, Donovan said:

I believe the simplest and easiest way to make both PD/SD/SADOC more realistic and " nerf " them is to just make people pay for their inventory.

---

Now what do I mean by that, well as it is done IRL both cruisers and weaponary is signed out by an individual when taken out of the weaponary inside the precinct, so the change I would be really happy with both RP and Gameplay wise and I am pretty sure most would agree is to assign a monetary value to both vehicle and guns/ammo which would be payed for from their SALARY ( IE: If you are about to be paid 100k at the end of the week, removing the cost of Crown Vic + Carbine + ammo you end up with 50k  for example obviously numbers are a subject to change but its clear enough for example which means if you haven't earned enough money through salary aka playing the game, you cannot just log in once a week and take a carbine and a super car out unless you are high rank ie: high command+ which all this wouldnt apply to)

---

For example : On the first time when I take a vehicle as a member of PD during a week ( When salaries roll out ) depending on the vehicle of choice I pay a certain amount of money for it ( Look at it as leasing/renting a vehicle ) so for the argument sake let's say Crown Vic costs 40.000$ and make it so every time I " spawn " in crown vic it will be that specific one and in the same condition as it was when I have parked it ( same fuel, same state visually and same state engine wise )

What is the point of it? Well quite easily it will make people do several things :
1) Value their vehicle as they will have to repair it and refuel it making both their driving regularly and in pursuits different as every time they'd flip bcs they would go for an insane ram or go in a turn 200 km/h and slam into a wall they would be losing money out of their pocket

2)  As vehicles wont be free, the swaps of vehicles will be lower and departments inside PD will be considerably more distinct both RP and gameplay wise as you wouldn't see high rank members taking cars/vehicles as they please and parking them 10 minutes later to take a new one

Same goes for weaponary and I will list examples bellow as how it would work :

Taking a Carbine out would cost 10.000$ with every 100 rounds costing the same amount of money criminals pay for their ammunation ( STOCK PRICE ) so in this case Carbine ammo = AK ammo price wise.

With this introduction, it would not only make people carry less weapons around with them, but also selectively use them and not for example use a carbine for every situation, or spray 100 bullets when 10-20 are needed with a bit of a smarter playstyle.

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At the end of a shift both weapon and vehicle are remembered to the specific character and every time they'd take that weaponary out in the same week they wouldn't pay a fee but they wouldn't be able to obtain a fresh vehicle/new carbine but would need to take more ammo from weaponary inside precinct ( which they'd pay for ) and repair a vehicle inside LSC/Bayview back to its original state.
 

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I am prepared for people to disagree with me but I am pretty sure that many would see this as a very nice way to both increase and highly differentiate RP inside PD/SD/SADOC and divisions inside each of them and at the same time " nerf " both the mentality and playstyle of legal factions.

ps: i am typing this in a rush so grammar mistakes are possible, if somehow this idea goes through I will be more than happy to make a more detailed post on how everything would work and explain my idea in depth.

I'm not against this idea in general, but make it so the value is removed from the budget for the LSPD and not individual salaries. Like others have pointed out it makes no sense to make government workers pay for their equipment, that is a burden the agency they are employed by must carry. 

 

Furthermore, for both ammo, weapons and vehicles I would expect the value of these things in terms of restocking and repairing vehicles to be significantly reduced. Doesn't make much RP sense to charge a law enforcement agency the same value for ammo as some drug cartel selling to criminals.

 

 Unless these changes are done then that's a big - 1 from me. 

Edited July 4, 2020 by Kyle White Raven

[CaesarSeizure]

I think the main thing everyone seems to forget, is that while PD loses nothing, PD gains nothing. You get involved in shootouts with PD because there is no other out for you, while we do not engage them. We respond. Now obviously if we were standing to lose something, it is only logical that we stand to gain something as well, dont you think?

[Jleoni]

18 minutes ago, CaesarSeizure said:

I think the main thing everyone seems to forget, is that while PD loses nothing, PD gains nothing. You get involved in shootouts with PD because there is no other out for you, while we do not engage them. We respond. Now obviously if we were standing to lose something, it is only logical that we stand to gain something as well, dont you think?

PD gains passive salary, and has the most risk-free 'fun' (shooting) available. There is a damn good reason of all the factions PD/SD are the ones with generally closed recruitment

[Riderz]

3 hours ago, Jleoni said:

PD gains passive salary, and has the most risk-free 'fun' (shooting) available. There is a damn good reason of all the factions PD/SD are the ones with generally closed recruitment

The only time shooting is made available is when others begin it. Just as it would be in the real world. Law Enforcement are reactive meaning they can only engage in response to situation; versus all others who are the catalyst (meaning they begin the reactions).