BallinByNature

You can speculate, we've just told you your speculations are false, that's all. The intent is to try something new, have a few staff establish a faction to be handed off to players eventually to see how it works out, a pilot test. This has no change / bearing to the current official applications and player-created faction system, so no I do not see how this is an unfortunate signal for them, other than they have another gang in the city to compete with perhaps. - It was decided before you had become the first Official Legal Faction we would not allow a faction to start up under the legal guise and then transition to illegal because the paths are different and the tools given to these factions are different as well. This will be true for all factions who start up as Legal Factions, such as a business. We actually do not prevent you from RPing criminal activity or monitor that very heavily. You can be criminal and act as a criminal (which you have as your time as "legal faction") and follow your RP story. What you want is access to gun imports out of the blue when you've been RPing as semi-legal. Not only does it sound weird ICly that the Cartel would be importing to your legal MC which had / may still have police characters in it, but it is a clear OOC motivation for gun imports only, and not that you just are not able to do anything criminal at all or RP properly etc. They were allowed the transfers to help set up the backstory which they will eventually probably not participate in any longer. Every player who joins Lost MC will have to work hard to get their cash and bikes too, and then they will own the faction, while staff no longer does. They're also not funding much of anything criminal, they're buying bikes and housing etc. which will help staff establish a faction lore to hand off. This decision actually has no impact on other factions / the current faction system but you're free to have your opinion that we're killing them. These factions don't go through FM / or applications, we establish them together as a staff team, therefore it is not effecting anyone else's application status / time etc. I understand being confused and speculating but it is strange Luxas because you were in the Faction Leaders chat and given the announcement explaining these factions yet you still are here spinning it as if you did not see that. Perhaps you did not read it before quitting, but it seems a bit disingenuous that you're acting surprised at information that was previously given to you. These staff created factions will have the same guidelines as player run factions and will be only part of the factions for a period of time to get them up and running for other players. Therefore, it will be players in control of these and will follow the same guidelines, and it has no long term benefits for the characters they have established to help out with the system. As for the transfer requests, these are not characters they are transferring to because they're bored with their character, want to move assets that don't make sense, want to start a new character and bring over their large assets. Feel free to show me if any properties / buildings have been transferred but I don't think they have yet you compare it to moving entire assets of gas stations when players are quitting their alts. These are not even characters they will play long term, they are setting these up to create a proper lore for players to follow / join in, and eventually hand off that lore / standard to the players once it's established. It is something to test out and try - and has nothing to do with anyone else "not being good enough" or whatever was said, we're just trying a method of creating a faction which we think might bring some good RP to the community, if you disagree that is certainly fine, and will be noted for our testing. Thanks for your feed back everyone!

@Kyle White Raven IC protocol wasn't followed in the scenario you're taking your reasoning from, nor was OOC protocol. Each player, including PD/SD players, are capable of non-RP (roleplaying actions which are unrealistic) and that is what this was determined to be. I disagree, if their actions are unrealistic and effect other peoples RP negatively, as per the Server Roleplay rules, that should certainly not be allowed. Additionally they do have the full autonomy to determine the charges on a suspect, if they've actually confirmed who their suspect is. This is already the case, too. However being that we're in an environment with limited players, praying on the fact of limited diversity and a high guessing probability, is not sufficient to be randomly placing charges -OR- attacking any player in a situation not involving police at all. You cannot "guess" you have the right person, you must know, or you could be guilty of DMing there as well. This rule is not something new, all players are held to the non-RP standard of performing realistic actions. Having this rule actually does the exact opposite, it sets the guideline that basic investigations are actually required (not prevented?) instead of just guessing at charges which would not hold up in any real sense. Charging criminals based on your personal hunch after having done little to no investigative work is not a realistic action for a player with the OOC privilege PD / SD players are granted. + It is clear to me that you didn't read the entire opinion or did and are trying to straw-man the excerpted quote. The full explanation clearly states those things can be the bases of basic investigation, he could be a lead suspect, brought in for questioning, go to their home and stake out to see if he arrives in the vehicle, etc etc etc. Just because you cannot blindly charge them, you now can't have any IC story building? Was blindly charging them the pinnacle of your RP story building really? Implying that these are reasonable OOC actions is precisely misinterpreting the ruling of the report. An officer placing felony charges as a guess on someone then providing the evidence that they were placed based off a personal educated guess based off clothing and voice sound, is not at all a reasonable IC interaction. So that is not at all the precedent being set. As mentioned to Dashingly below, identifiable yes, evidence sufficient of being a valid charge, no. The ruling encouraged further RP with him as a suspect, but just because 1 officer has a correct gut feeling, doesn't make a charge valid. Continuing to investigate wasn't done. The person was not driving their own car. Hair style and clothing alone are not sufficient evidence for an irrefutable charge. This is precisely what was done in the report, he placed the charges based off of mask and voice. What this means is you have to follow your PD/SD protocol which says the exact same things. That is correct if you have no evidence that it was that person, they were not caught in the act, and they have not given any sort of admission of guilt what so ever, you cannot place irrefutable charges based on clothing worn, a tattoo, voice, or accessories alone. "and have gone through a bunch of other investigative RP" is being awfully generous considering absolutely 0 investigative RP was done before placing the charge based on the voice and clothing. Unrealistic actions (filing charges based on a personal educated guess with 0 evidence) are not an IC issue, all players are held to the non-RP standard within the rules. The player involved in the report had prior reports and cases where he charged them in similar fashion with a mask on as well, so it is not as rare as you claim. Only someone intentionally trying to misread the ruling would suggest they can not be charged, because it says very plainly as explained that it can be the basis of further investigation and possibly eventually lead to a charge with more evidence. That is up for your RP to decide, but you don't get to place irrefutable charges based on your characters best educated guess and do 0 investigation and claim you can't ever place charges now. The frequency of a non-RP action does not make it more or less non-RP in most cases. A player being charged unrealistically, just once, is an issue to be worked on / corrected. An OOC rule wasn't created once again, OOC rules surrounding realistic acitons are indeed needed, and were already in place prior (non-RP). Is visually seeing clothing , tattoos, and vehicles, the only investigative RP available in your opinion? In my opinion, that's a very surface level observation any officer can make, let alone a full on detectives investigation which should be far more in-depth. Do you truly believe placing charges based off a brief visual of him stepping out of a car and shooting at the officer for a few seconds is the pinnacle of investigative RP and he has exhausted all resources to confirm his suspect? I would disagree completely. Precisely why it is both unrealistic and not allowed. In no realistic way would charges stand up based on a confident identity guess with facial obstruction. No one told them to ignore their IC guess, we just asked them to RP them out realistically, not place unrealistic irrefutable charges based on a personal educated guess. @TheCactus Because the MDC does not pop up their name via their ID does not mean it is not possible to metagame someone's identity. He also wasn't even punished for metagaming, it was for non-RP. The ability to "guess" based on voip or player model is drastically increased by OOC information in a small community which has much less chance of having a doppleganger (especially while wearing a mask) than real life may be, that is why your guess is not entirely an IC guess when you're basing it off player model and voice. Additionally people can have multiple characters so saying that their characters voice is so unique to them as the sole basis for identifying them is not a fair OOC tactic what so ever in terms of valuing the RP possibilities. Your statement that if you have enough evidence is fine, however, guessing based off a voice sound during a car chase and a brief interaction seeing their mask as they are shooting at you, is not "enough evidence" as confirmed by PD / SD chiefs during discussion. The protocols in place within the faction both OOC and IC require more for placing charges, so doing so in violation of the OOC / IC protocols is not an IC issue. The officer wasn't punished for successfully confirming the identity, it is well stated in the full explanation that these things could be used as the basis for investigation / targeting a suspect. What he was punished for was placing charges with absolutely 0 evidence other than personal guess. He could definitely follow up and use his successful guess as the basis for a proper RP investigation with a primary suspect. No, it is not your fault people do that. Just your fault if you place irrefutable charges based on clothing alone which is unrealistic. Just because you know Ricky Brasco wears a blue t shirt a lot doesn't mean you can go around charging any suspect in a blue t-shirt as Ricky Brasco. Arguing the ability to guess charges based on clothing and voice sounds alone is unrealistic. If you know you're gonna charge, gather evidence. @Dashingly identifiable yes, evidence sufficient of being a valid charge, no. The ruling encouraged further RP with him as a suspect, but just because 1 officer has a correct gut feeling, doesn't make a charge valid. It isn't, and prior RP experience with a person shouldn't be an ' ability to charge irrefutably based on a situational guess' either. Actions that are unrealistic which promote a poor quality of RP have and always will be an OOC issue under the non-RP rule.

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