alexalex303

Being asked to step out at a traffic stop is the opposite of NonRP, it is very realistic. I find it very peculiar that one of your complaints is that an officer would roleplay looking through your windows to look for weapons. How is law enforcement roleplaying with you an issue? The reason why multiple officers are present at a traffic stop is simple, when there isn't, people shoot them. If cops got shot at traffic stops in LA as much as they do in-game, I guarantee that the national guard would be on the streets. Cops roleplaying with you should never be an issue on a roleplaying server. Even if that roleplay ends up with you getting arrested, that shouldn't affect your feelings out-of-character. If you would like to state that it's an issue that the police force is too effective (as in you do not like that you get arrested), then please state it plainly. Calling valid actions NonRP does not make a good point, nor will create a situation where we discuss your actual issue.

The issue with comparing ECRP with real-life is that we do not have access to helicopters in the same way the LAPD does. The LAPD helicopter is virtually impossible to lose, you will see people with crazy super bikes not able to shake it for hours, they literally wait for them to run out of fuel. The in-game helicopter is pitifully slow, and is limited by draw distance and angles. Something else to keep in mind is that in real-life, cops will stop pursuits because they can always charge you later. The whole thing we do here on ECRP where mask = it wasn't me, wouldn't hold up in court. If someone that generally looks like you (masked or not) evades from cops in your car, you're going to prison. There's no such thing as "many people have keys". Literally wouldn't hold up. example of a pursuit where helicopter was used, and in the end chase was called off, driver later charged based on ownership https://www.foxla.com/news/reckless-driver-evades-police-after-pursuit-through-hollywood So, the whole realism thing is out of the window already. In the context of the game, super cars are needed because player cars are very high performance versus cop cars. GTA is a game about crime, and police vehicles were purposefully under-tuned, so that they would chase you, but not be very good at catching you. It would not be a healthy roleplay server if anyone with an elegy could just evade whenever they felt like it. The elegy is already a pretty meh car and we have the actually overpowered vehicles like the Issi Sport which even the T20 struggles against. Further exacerbating these issues is the fact that some players choose to lower their graphics much more than needed, in an effort to get better performance out of their vehicles, and someone doing 60 fps in the same vehicle as someone doing 144, will have a noticeable and game-impacting advantage. Therefore, there's a lot of things to consider when it comes to a game versus real-life and talking about Dubai is pointless. Most people in LA will not evade, not even gang members, it's a serious felony and you will get caught. I'm not even going to get into laws that specifically discourage this, that we do not have, such as the three strike laws further reading: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-strikes_law#:~:text=The three-strikes law significantly,other than a life sentence. tl;dr it's a game, and in the context of the game, super cars make sense. selective realism is not a good approach.

Date and time (provide timezone): 19/APR/2021 1100 UTC Character name: Jason Steel Issue/bug you are reporting: Putting an LSPD vehicle on a flatbed makes it become a non-LSPD vehicle. Expected behavior: The vehicle should remain a faction vehicle. Evidence, notes worth mentioning, steps to replicate: Find an LSPD faction vehicle Place it on a flatbed Take it off the flatbed https://i.imgur.com/PlM6gD3.png Vehicle license plate number*: N/A

The only bad thing about this suggestion is that there is no song to go with it. major +1

I'm glad you agree. This rule is here to make sure that four gangs don't bully one gang out of existence. That is never good for the server, even if we try to justify it with "RP reasons". If such a rule was around a lot longer ago, we wouldn't need faction management to create a street gang. If such a rule was around a lot longer ago, we could still have a racing gang in Wanted and so on. Regardless of all the of the character development that occurred in order for three gangs of very different background to decide they want to hold hands, at the end of the day, it's extremely silly to have for example an Asian Syndicate team up with an African American street gang in order to directly fight an Italian Mafia. It just doesn't happen. Gangs are supposed to look after their own interests, try to make themselves #1, not share #4 spot with three other gangs. And just to be clear, I was on both sides of it too, yeah, I never said I wasn't. That was the norm back then, it's not anymore, and I'm glad it is isn't.

As with all things, I would advise using common sense. If for example your gang opens up a pub every week, having other gangs show up there would be highly regular and nothing out of the ordinary, another gang attacking that and complaining wouldn't be valid since it's a known routine thing. If you however spot some potentially hostile people near your HQ, and invite your friendly gangs to "chill", and it happens more than once, that is highly questionable. End of the day there is no clear line, just like there isn't one with fear RP, or with DM. There are some examples for DM, but the list is not all encompassing. There is no clear definition for what "close range" is for fear RP, and everyone has their own idea, but no hard line. That is how roleplaying works, it's all very situational.

Ruleplaying is ruleplaying, roleplaying is roleplaying. If you're actively trying to group up every time you feel like you're gonna get attacked, that's obviously ruleplaying. If you're genuinely trying to interact with other gangs occasionally, it will be fine. I do not think that anyone in the staff team is a robot and can not tell the difference. Just play it fair and trust in the staff team.

Then this rule doesn't affect you. This rule is directly related to you providing backup to a shootout/hostile scenario. You can group up all day and perform all your of roleplay as your faction. This has happened in every single major war since the original council. You can literally look in the player report archive and see massive 100+ man fights at chiliad between five to seven factions, as recent as a couple of months ago in the FSO/La Fam war. I've avoided naming factions as I don't want to seem like I'm attacking anyone. That was okay back then, it's not anymore. No, it shouldn't come back.

This rule was not introduced as a fix to a temporary problem, it was introduced as a fix to a problem as old as the (modern) server, starting with the original council. It is not healthy for the server for a small group of players to have a monopoly on gangs, and give those players the power to bully other players off the server. No matter the amount of supposed roleplay it generates, it does not create a healthy environment, and adds to OOC tensions. You stated that this rule stifles criminal diplomacy, I say that it strengthens it. Not the 120 man zerg going up Chiliad, that's dead, but actual diplomacy. Say you have gangs A, B and Z. A & B are on good terms, and for some reason gang B and Z are having a conflict, that maybe turned violent. Instead of having gangs A&B sit on a joint frequency all day and throw 100 man fights every time they see each other, gang A can provide support to gang B via soft power. That means providing weapons to help the other gang fight, provide drugs or cars to shop for the other gang to maintain influence, or even straight up cash. They can also refuse to provide any of these to the enemy faction. That is all backed up through roleplay. The only thing this rule harms is the TDM mentality, and in my opinion, it should never be removed or altered. Clarification is always welcome so long as it does not introduce loopholes (which is why I believe the current rule is vague).

Hey. Welcome back! Make sure to check out the server rules and possibly this revamped roleplay guide (https://forum.eclipse-rp.net/topic/16456-eclipse-roleplay-roleplay-guide/) Quite a lot has changed in two years, and you want to make sure that you start off on the right foot. Have fun!

@Percival you've been here longer than me but you're views are incredibly naïve and completely disregard server history. We've had the system that you talk about, we've had very little rules and regulations for factions. The result older factions forming a monopoly and pushing every other organization off the server. Monopolies are not good, and the last thing we need is to emulate a rust official server where we have 1 mega clan dominate it.

Jason Steel 12 tickets

So you weren't searched because you were a gang member, you were searched because you disobeyed law enforcement instruction.

The police have the upper hand in most places in the world. That's their job, to have the upper hand. It's called Law Enforcement, you need to be able to project power in order to enforce the law. Your numbers are useless because you are comparing population vs police officers. Real-life is not our server where 99% of people are either PD or Crim. The vast majority of people are neither. Let's use Los Angeles, since we're roleplaying in Los Santos. LAPD has 9000 officers and 3000 civilian employees, the LASD has 9900 deputies and 8000 civilian employees + 4200 civilian volunteers. The National Guard of California employs 23000 soldiers and airmen. Florencia 13 is a regional gang that originated in LA, the membership is estimated to be 3000+. It operates in LA. Fresno Bulldogs is the largest gang operating in Central Cali, 5000 to 6000 members. 38th Street Gang is one of the oldest street gangs in LA. They occupy large swats of territory, I was unable to find membership estimates, however, I do want to bring attention to law enforcement responses to them. On August 24, 2004, a law enforcement preliminary injunction terminated the active members of the 38th Street gang, out of the streets, banning them from using firearms, alcohol, graffiti and other dangerous materials in public. More on Gang Injunctions here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gang_injunction sources: https://www.justice.gov/archive/ndic/pubs27/27612/appendb.htm https://web.archive.org/web/20060323100803/http://www.lacity.org/atty/attypress/attyattypress6922441_08252004.pdf#search="38 street gang los angeles" The Los Angeles Police Department lost 210 officers in the line of duty, since its founding in 1869, 102 which were shot, and a good amount of the rest were traffic/aircraft accidents. In 2019 the LAPD lost two officers in the line of duty. sources: https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2019/preliminary-report/tables/table-4/state-cuts/table-4-alabama-through-california.xls https://www.odmp.org/agency/2221-los-angeles-police-department-california https://www.lapdonline.org/year_in_review/content_basic_view/66226 Do we remember the 38th street gang from earlier? In 2011, 53 members of the organization were the subject of a grand jury indictment under the RICO statute. Over 800 law enforcement officers participated in the raids on their houses and hangout spots. source: https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/02/los-angeles-street-gang-indicted.html So in short, gangs of up to 5000 members barely kill any law enforcement, they're the subject to intense repercussions from law enforcement, from injunctions that prohibit them from even speaking with each other, to full blown 800 person+ raids, but somehow, they have the upper hand? If anything, the police on the server is severely underpowered compared to real-life.

Why are you writing pseudo-code? It doesn't help explain your point any better. I don't understand your point about there being change if it was enforced. There was a lot of change. Speed cameras, robbery rules, faction caps, joint frequency rules, those are all changes to raise RP standard, and they did happen. As for not hearing what the community wants or needs, the mistake is thinking that just because someone doesn't budge they're not listening. Speed cameras were introduced and there was huge backlash from the community about them. I don't think there's a single staff member that doesn't know this. They listened, they just didn't give in. The fact of the matter is that these changes are likely to continue, whether you like it or not. The RP standard will continue to get pushed further and further, which is great for the people that want that. I know there's a somewhat silent legal RP group that enjoys this direction, and they were particularly vocal when they could finally gas up without being robbed by gangs. Just because certain playstyles that we had gotten used to, and even I partook in are changing does not mean that the server is dying, or that no one is listening. It's just that it's changing.

I do not necessarily disagree with anything that you've stated, but I do agree with @Bala's sentiment. It seems that way too often people will have this alarmist attitude "server is dying", in order to push their own personal agendas and try to revive a playstyle that was frankly toxic. The server is fine; A specific playstyle that some people enjoyed is no longer supported/allowed, but the overall server is fine, and some might even say better without that playstyle.

I think this is a knee-jerk reaction to change. -1 We can look at this again in a couple of months after everyone got used to it.

@Revelt comparing a voice RP server with a text RP server is not very good. I talked about this recently with a few people, as we all came from text RP, but it's definitively a whole different thing. In text RP, whenever you spoke, you had to type. It was very natural to continue typing and add a /me or an /ame. Even something as simple as /me nods. It felt natural. However, in voice RP. There will be times when I talk to people while they're being cuffed, and they stop answering to /mes and /dos, because they're talking, and they want to keep talking, but you can not talk while typing. In voice RP, typing (and therefore roleplaying) feels unnatural, because it stops you from talking, when you want to do it. I think that this is a really important distinction that people do not consider.

That is factually incorrect. Some of the largest roleplaying communities in the world have a zero tolerance on that sort of stuff, and there are literal queues to join/play.

Jason Steel 1 ticket DeAndre King 38 tickets

That is something that you made yourself, you can not blame the developers or the staff team for raising the roleplay standard just because you had a "bond" with a get out of jail free card. You can still drive your favorite bike all day, you might need to go to the gas station more often, and you can no longer easily escape from all RP consequences, but the bike is still there. I believe that your attitude, and the attitude of most people in this thread is not about loss of RP opportunities, or bonds, or whatever, it's directly related to the fact that you can no longer escape all roleplay consequences by using a drag. There were people that made arguments that executing someone next to an NCZ was realistic because they had a drag to get away on and a mask on. That is the kind of behavior that these nerfs addressed. The lack of consequences, not your RP style, nor your RP choices. If you liked the drag for looks, or RP reasons, those are both still there.

I almost always had a good time interacting with the more senior members of the organization, and especially in the current climate, it's definitively a loss to the server and the overall criminal RP. It was a good run.

This. It would effectively turn drags and other license plate less bikes into scrapyard vehicles.

Yes, I've bought the actual suit jacket many times just to be able to buy an undershirt, and then throw the jacket away. +1

This is a double edged sword. How many videos do you see with cops named cop21 or cop20 and so on. Would you really remember every single cop if you saw them off-duty in civilian clothes three months later? No. This isn't a problem with PD, it's with the alias system in genereal.