MDC while off-duty

[Asiantator]

1 minute ago, MrSilky said:

I think everyone is missing the point here. 'On duty' on the server = /fduty (unlocking script access to police stuff). What OP is suggesting is that regardless of your /fduty status, you can still login to the MDC to assist on-duty police conduct their work should you be requested/required to do so. It is always better for the primary witness (off-duty officer in this case) to apply the charge.

I understand everyone's counter arguments, but this isn't suggesting to give off-duty cops more privileges, it's simply to allow cops to use the computer be they in uniform or not which RPly they would be able to do as you do not forget how to use a PC when you leave work. As I said, It would need strict internal rules but it is something I would like to see changed.

Thanks for the clarification. In this case I can see it working but would need an addition to the IC and OOC rules on it.

[Msato]

Neutral - It could be useful in unique scenarios but there would need to be faction rules preventing it from being abused as mentioned. 

Honestly I believe that the MDC deserves a full overhaul of its current system. There have been many suggestions on tweaking the MDC from both legal and criminal. 

Perhaps instead of removing set features or adding more the whole system can be redone to providing a satisfying change for both ends. Of course this would be another suggestion in its self and would be great to see criminals / legals work together on detailing a system that is tailored nice for each end. 

[Riderz]

-1 

Due to the current set of the internal rules applying to them it would be easily abused. An the old saying going "If it can be used, it will be abused".

[Cyrus Raven]

6 minutes ago, Tezhl said:

-1 

Due to the current set of the internal rules applying to them it would be easily abused. An the old saying going "If it can be used, it will be abused".

I'm genuinely curious, how could this be abused? I've seen a few people bring it up already, but I can't really picture what would change from how it is right now. As far as I know any LEO can just walk into their respective precincts, /fduty or Ctrl+D and access the MDC. Being able to do this regardless of /fduty status wouldn't change the locations where you can access the MDC, unless I am overlooking something. 

Edited October 8, 2019 by Kyle White Raven

[KrismeisterSG]

-1

I think it's actually more RP for you to go up Paleto, deal with the paperwork and get the investigation going. As an off duty officer, at least, that's how it works IRL, you'd be considered a normal witness and you being an officer doesn't grant you any other value more than a civilian. You'd have to discuss with your collegues who'd gather your information and fill in a report (Call 911). Doing the way you're saying, just being off duty and having access to the MDC would just skip this whole RP process.

[Cyrus Raven]

7 minutes ago, KrismeisterSG said:

-1

I think it's actually more RP for you to go up Paleto, deal with the paperwork and get the investigation going. As an off duty officer, at least, that's how it works IRL, you'd be considered a normal witness and you being an officer doesn't grant you any other value more than a civilian. You'd have to discuss with your collegues who'd gather your information and fill in a report (Call 911). Doing the way you're saying, just being off duty and having access to the MDC would just skip this whole RP process.

I get your point, but we already do skip this RP, in the state that our server hosts the word of an officer is considered to be above of a civilians, this comes with a lot of responsibility, but that's how it works. As I mentioned before, adding this feature or not would only affect how long suspects spend in the back of the cruiser waiting for the witnessing officer to charge him, everything else from procedures to the amount of paperwork would remain the same. 

[Marca]

I don't understand the flawed logic by most people here. The end result is still the same, but it saves everyone's time in the end. It also makes RP sense an officer can enter the MDC without having the uniform on, it doesn't stop him if he's in his pyjamas.

Currently: Off duty officer arrests someone > on duty officer arrives > takes him to his local PD > off duty officer has to go on duty in his own PD (MR or PB, can take a long time to get from one to the other) > applies charges > goes off duty > done.
Suggestion: Off duty officer arrests someone > on duty officer arrives > takes him to his local PD > off duty officer applies the charges > done.

Fuck's the difference in the end, apart from it saving time and being more realistic? Also do most of you know you CAN be placed under citizens arrest by a citizen? lol

[alexalex303]

7 minutes ago, Marca said:

I don't understand the flawed logic by most people here. The end result is still the same, but it saves everyone's time in the end. It also makes RP sense an officer can enter the MDC without having the uniform on, it doesn't stop him if he's in his pyjamas.

Currently: Off duty officer arrests someone > on duty officer arrives > takes him to his local PD > off duty officer has to go on duty in his own PD (MR or PB, can take a long time to get from one to the other) > applies charges > goes off duty > done.
Suggestion: Off duty officer arrests someone > on duty officer arrives > takes him to his local PD > off duty officer applies the charges > done.

Fuck's the difference in the end, apart from it saving time and being more realistic? Also do most of you know you CAN be placed under citizens arrest by a citizen? lol

It's you that doesn't understand the issue.

I'm saying that the cop doing that right now is pretty bad roleplay and it shouldn't be further supported by the script.

You can be detained by a civilian in what's colloquially called a citizen's arrest, however, you can NOT be charged by a civilian. 

 

[Cyrus Raven]

20 minutes ago, alexalex303 said:

It's you that doesn't understand the issue.

I'm saying that the cop doing that right now is pretty bad roleplay and it shouldn't be further supported by the script.

You can be detained by a civilian in what's colloquially called a citizen's arrest, however, you can NOT be charged by a civilian. 

 

You are taking things too literally. It's bad RP in your mind because you're pretending that this is exactly as things happen IRL and while taking IRL examples can be good in some cases, in others it makes no sense.

I would agree with you that this would contribute to bad RP if off-duty officers as it stands couldn't detain and call a marked unit to transport a suspect after having detained/arrested them, returning to their precinct to go on-duty and then charging them. But that's exactly how it works right now. So taking that into account, this suggestion is convenient and adheres to the current way things work.

If you have an issue with how cops work and think rules should be added with regards to how they act off-duty then that is a completely different issue and a larger criticism of PD/SD in general. I just wish you would get straight to this point instead of shooting down this suggestion under some premise that it's ''unrealistic'' or ''Non-RP''.

[Einaras]

can i rp get your info to get onto mdc and check anyone i want to ? while youre offduty ? maybe while youre offduty you need and panic button ? :3

[Einaras]

sorry, big no

[Victor Einhart]

-1.  You already have advanced privileges when it comes to being involved in a crime while you're off duty, both formal (your word and a charge can be added to someone whereas a civilian's word is not enough), and informal (your buddies will probably believe your story over some nobody).  While I agree it would be convenient to access this system while off duty, I don't think it's ok to add yet another layer of privileges when you already hold all the cards in a situation like this.

[Cyrus Raven]

15 minutes ago, Victor Einhart said:

-1.  You already have advanced privileges when it comes to being involved in a crime while you're off duty, both formal (your word and a charge can be added to someone whereas a civilian's word is not enough), and informal (your buddies will probably believe your story over some nobody).  While I agree it would be convenient to access this system while off duty, I don't think it's ok to add yet another layer of privileges when you already hold all the cards in a situation like this.

I'll ask you the same question I asked someone else.

''I'm genuinely curious, how could this be abused? I've seen a few people bring it up already, but I can't really picture what would change from how it is right now. As far as I know any LEO can just walk into their respective precincts, /fduty or Ctrl+D and access the MDC. Being able to do this regardless of /fduty status wouldn't change the locations where you can access the MDC, unless I am overlooking something.''
 

[Drizzy.]

I'm on the fence to be honest. Usually the situation where you need MDC access is  when you're on duty performing your duties. MDC is Government property of which you need to be on duty/on shift to access. Out of bounds access (unless Im mistaken) is usually not allowed unless you're in some specific branch like IB. Correct me if Im wrong but accessing MDC off duty has to be improper use? 

Edited October 9, 2019 by DrizzyDre

[Chrisy]

Next you’ll be asking to be paid off duty as well 

 

-1 there’s no reason to use the MDC while not on duty, call 911

[Cyrus Raven]

6 minutes ago, Chrisy said:

Next you’ll be asking to be paid off duty as well 

 

-1 there’s no reason to use the MDC while not on duty, call 911

Did you read any of the above ?

[Victor Einhart]

1 hour ago, Kyle White Raven said:

I'll ask you the same question I asked someone else.

''I'm genuinely curious, how could this be abused? I've seen a few people bring it up already, but I can't really picture what would change from how it is right now. As far as I know any LEO can just walk into their respective precincts, /fduty or Ctrl+D and access the MDC. Being able to do this regardless of /fduty status wouldn't change the locations where you can access the MDC, unless I am overlooking something.''
 

You can use big boy words to relay information to other officers.  I get that it's a convenience but honestly it's already no bueno to use other forms of faction equipment off duty.  I don't see why an exception should be made here when one can just speak to their co-workers and achieve the same result.

[alexalex303]

1 hour ago, Kyle White Raven said:

I'll ask you the same question I asked someone else.

''I'm genuinely curious, how could this be abused? I've seen a few people bring it up already, but I can't really picture what would change from how it is right now. As far as I know any LEO can just walk into their respective precincts, /fduty or Ctrl+D and access the MDC. Being able to do this regardless of /fduty status wouldn't change the locations where you can access the MDC, unless I am overlooking something.''
 

Because you shouldn't be doing that. We should not add script support for bad roleplay.

I can not imagine a single scenario in which an off-duty cop would realistically jump into a cruiser and then be like "alright im off-duty but I witnessed it so let me charge this guy, get him sent to prison and fined for 20k".

Communicate with the officers there and create some roleplay with players. Give your testimony, and see what they do with it. That's the good approach. 

[Cyrus Raven]

9 hours ago, alexalex303 said:

Because you shouldn't be doing that. We should not add script support for bad roleplay.

I can not imagine a single scenario in which an off-duty cop would realistically jump into a cruiser and then be like "alright im off-duty but I witnessed it so let me charge this guy, get him sent to prison and fined for 20k".

Communicate with the officers there and create some roleplay with players. Give your testimony, and see what they do with it. That's the good approach. 

Alex, I understand your perspective, but what you want involves a wider system change, which I'm not sure everyone supports. This suggestion was meant to improve how the current system works, but if you obviously disagree with the current system then of course you wouldn't want this suggestion implemented, I get it now.

If you want to push for more realism on the server then I will most likely also +1 it. There are things like criminals owning businesses, gang members having very expensive vehicles, cops having very expensive vehicles, being able to go off-road with a super/sports, etc.. Which I think is unrealistic and should be changed, so if you want to make a thread about it I'll plus one it.

[Cyrus Raven]

10 hours ago, Victor Einhart said:

You can use big boy words to relay information to other officers.  I get that it's a convenience but honestly it's already no bueno to use other forms of faction equipment off duty.  I don't see why an exception should be made here when one can just speak to their co-workers and achieve the same result.

I mean, this shows a lack of understanding about how the current system works. If this could be fixed by simply talking to other officers don't you think I would have thought about that...

The point is that it is the handbook's recommendation that Deputies and Officers apply charges themselves when they are the one who witnessed the crime happening. If you're on-duty that's fairly simple. However, if you are off-duty this forces you to go back to your precinct (which might be far-away) and get on-duty for literally 20 seconds just to place a charge.

Again, I would like to STRESS that this isn't an issue for most people, we will make the trip without a problem. But it might mean that suspects stay in the back of the cruiser waiting for the officer/deputy to go and apply charges and comeback (or call) to the arrest officer, which ends up being more time wasted. If the majority of the community is ok with that, then fair-play, but if you want to make things more efficient, then this suggestion might make sense.

Also, I see you were unable to actually point out how this suggestion can get ''abused''.

[BadZanta]

-1

[SaltyPython]

I'm genuinely puzzled with all the ad hominem attacks going on right now towards OP. Guys, he's suggesting something that could lower the time you waste as you get arrested. You can argue that you don't like the suggestion but going ahead and attacking the OP for the way he RP's, especially so unprompted is baffling me. The way some people are being so condescending over a suggestion is kind of ridiculous. Ye need to goddamn chill.

In my opinion this can be a thing as long as it's regulated well, but if the effort isn't put in to make sure this isn't abused, it will cause major problems.

I would be more in favour of changing the paradigm in how RP is done right now though, and possibly avoid this suggestion.

Edited October 9, 2019 by SaltyPython

[HoneyBadger]

Police department software and databases are really secure. Only way to login to it is using internal connection or special routing that grants you access to closed off network and that access isn't given to random police officers. If you are a witness to a crime then arresting officer should take your statement and add those charges himself. Friend is a police officer and they don't have such access while off duty. Only way to add charges is to be on duty, working. Don't think that is realistic so -1 from me. 

[Freclan]

37 minutes ago, HoneyBadger said:

Police department software and databases are really secure. Only way to login to it is using internal connection or special routing that grants you access to closed off network and that access isn't given to random police officers. If you are a witness to a crime then arresting officer should take your statement and add those charges himself. Friend is a police officer and they don't have such access while off duty. Only way to add charges is to be on duty, working. Don't think that is realistic so -1 from me. 

Gangsters running around with aks on their back all day is hardly realistic either, this argument doesn't make sense.

[Xoza]

+1

A law enforcement officer is an enforcer of the law, whether on or off duty and can either way, go on duty, place charges then go off duty. This would eliminate that unnecessary and non-RP of running in to script 'on duty' to place charges then get off duty.

Lets work on making things more efficient so we can get back to the RP itself.

Edited October 9, 2019 by Xoza