Not enough law enforcement in the city to rob bank?

[JohnnydaHo]

This one is just silly. Yesterday we had 5 cruisers pull up for an 11mph over speeding infraction but then get the message that there is not enough police in the city to do the bank. It should be incumbent on the Police factions to organize their shifts to protect the city. their failure to do that should not result in this unrealistic restriction on bank availability. 

[Victor Einhart]

If you know people who are up at 5oclock in the morning and playing, please tell them to apply to LSPD.

[Asiantator]

TBH if I am forced to work PD at a specific time I will probably leave the server. I come here to relax after work, not have a 2nd unpaid job.

[jdeclue1]

So to add some detail, we had just completed Chumash successfully, around 5pm UTC, with approximately 150 players on the server, after dropping off the proceeds, Route 68 was open so we setup for it, the number of police must’ve dropped below the threshold and our attempt at a 2nd bank in a row was thwarted by the server script. I understand not having enough police around can be an issue, it was just interesting because during the transition between the two banks one of our crew was pulled over by 5+ vehicles with 7+ officers, which I would assume is sufficient to take on a bank crew of 6-8. No hate from this side, just adding some clarity.

[JohnnydaHo]

2 hours ago, Victor Einhart said:

If you know people who are up at 5oclock in the morning and playing, please tell them to apply to LSPD.

Point is why interfere in others RP because one faction does not have enough people on doing their job? So what if a bank job is done with fewer PD in the server...the robbers do not know that....telling them only means they know they can do other crimes easier.

[Bala]

56 minutes ago, JohnnydaHo said:

Point is why interfere in others RP because one faction does not have enough people on doing their job? So what if a bank job is done with fewer PD in the server...the robbers do not know that....telling them only means they know they can do other crimes easier.

Well Ho, if there are not enough cops on to provide more than token resistance to your bank robbery, then it's a bit too easy isn't it? Might as well have the NPCs giving you the money without having to open the vault if that's the case.

[JohnnydaHo]

 Well La, some are easier, some are harder. IMO that's a better system than having the bank tell robbers they cant rob right now cause not enough cops and in the process giving out information that would otherwise not be known at all. 

[Frezas]

Man, if you say that PD can't organize their shifts then ask MD, DCC, DOC, SD the same question, all factions have a period in the day when they don't have enough units to cover things. I should be angry that I am doing MD job when I am the only one in duty on so called ''morning shift''. You can see that a lot of PD members resigned and most of them had one and same reason, they didn't have enough time, so you will force us to go on shift when I should be sleeping or working just for you to shoot at us and evade with BF400 up the mountain ? I don't think so. 

EDIT: Come over to rob a bank at 5am yourself, why we should stay without RP patrolling the city ? 

Edited November 16, 2021 by Frezas

[Jett_J]

On 11/15/2021 at 5:50 PM, jdeclue1 said:

So to add some detail, we had just completed Chumash successfully, around 5pm UTC, with approximately 150 players on the server, after dropping off the proceeds, Route 68 was open so we setup for it, the number of police must’ve dropped below the threshold and our attempt at a 2nd bank in a row was thwarted by the server script. I understand not having enough police around can be an issue, it was just interesting because during the transition between the two banks one of our crew was pulled over by 5+ vehicles with 7+ officers, which I would assume is sufficient to take on a bank crew of 6-8. No hate from this side, just adding some clarity.

Also need to consider that 6-8 is scattered across the entire city (If PD and SD are sharing jurisdiction) People responding from the Blaine County area to a bank robbery in the city won't even make it on time.

 

[jdeclue1]

13 hours ago, Jett_J said:

Also need to consider that 6-8 is scattered across the entire city (If PD and SD are sharing jurisdiction) People responding from the Blaine County area to a bank robbery in the city won't even make it on time.

 

Totally understand. Thanks for your input.

[JohnnydaHo]

TBF this is not a 5:00am issue. We have run into this issue during prime time hours 8:00pm UK time.

[dominykas]

Quote

Police activity is not determined by the sufficient presence of criminals, why should criminal activity be determined by the presence of law enforcement?

It's interesting you say this because the only criminal activity that is determined by law enforcement presence are bank robberies. Like mentioned above law enforcement members can't be awake and playing 24/7 for some criminals to rob a bank and simply drive up a hill to eventually lose them. You need to understand that people have in-real-life work, studies and other business.

[oskarscot]

Banks are high risk high reward, IRL if a bank robbery went off vast majority of police units would go there instantly. This is GTA, different time zones, people have work/school/life outside of gta. This would've been abused as people would do bank robberies at night when there's no cops around

[Shining0103]

If you guys really feel the need to rob banks at 5 am, when I should be sleeping and instead I'm forced to go in game and on shift (as if it was a real job) for your own pleasure, I'm willing to open a gofundme so you can pay me an adequate salary.  

Edited December 15, 2021 by Shining0103

[jason]

The simple answer is that we don't want people to be able to spawn a large amount of money with no effort or risk due to the lack of any counter presence. There's nothing more to add to this or discuss, it's an objectively bad thing for the entire server economy to have large amounts of money spawned like this.

[Shining0103]

1 hour ago, Kieran Horn said:

There is no consideration for that when it comes to criminal factions. The double standard is a bit infuriating. 

With all due respect, criminal factions could come up with suggestions on how and what activities would possibly provide a better alternative to chain-bank robberies and grinding drugs. Many suggestions were made through time, @Bala opened entire threads on how this could be possibly improved, and there's been a recent inside on the upcoming criminal update as well. Someone might even suggest alternative RP scenarios that do not require script support, just like @Lola did with the jewelry store or the pharmacy. 

 

For the love of God, and this is more of a general comment rather than specifically aimed at you: Stop blaming PD or any other law enforcement faction when you have no fucking clue on how this affects OUR experience as well, which is as infuriating as it might be for criminals, just from a different point of view.

Edited December 15, 2021 by Shining0103

[JohnnydaHo]

 A bank job yield's vary rarely amounting to more than 25k per robber and I have seen as low as  $9600. Considering the time it takes to assemble, prepare and execute the robbery, you have to take into account the fact that these robbers could otherwise be out there doing legal jobs and collectively "spawning money" in amounts sometimes more than what a bank job pays given the time it takes.   

[jason]

5 minutes ago, JohnnydaHo said:

Considering the time it takes to assemble, prepare and execute the robbery,  

None of this is needed if there's no opposition. You can just show up with a drill and one other person and vibe for a bit.

[Osborn]

9 hours ago, jason said:

The simple answer is that we don't want people to be able to spawn a large amount of money with no effort or risk due to the lack of any counter presence. There's nothing more to add to this or discuss, it's an objectively bad thing for the entire server economy to have large amounts of money spawned like this.

Hey, this is pretty much the answer to this. Bank Robberies have the potential to generate a lot of money, and it's intended to be done with sufficient law enforcement online to be able to respond and react to the roleplay.

[Destuin]

I think it would be fine, especially with the very long cooldown time of banks. Nearly all the banks are hit during the day, so they would rarely even be available at night. It doesn't make any sense RP wise, it is just another OOC restriction placed on one side :(.

[JohnnydaHo]

14 hours ago, jason said:

None of this is needed if there's no opposition. You can just show up with a drill and one other person and vibe for a bit.

Obviously you have never done a bank robbery and are unaware that it takes 2 aimers while others drill and bolt cut. The justification you have provided is flawed as I have shown above. Nobody robs banks with 2 people and there is no influx of cash to the server much greater than if the robbers mined for oil for the time it takes to pull it off.

[Jett_J]

6 hours ago, JohnnydaHo said:

Obviously you have never done a bank robbery and are unaware that it takes 2 aimers while others drill and bolt cut. The justification you have provided is flawed as I have shown above. Nobody robs banks with 2 people and there is no influx of cash to the server much greater than if the robbers mined for oil for the time it takes to pull it off.

It's still free money for nothing. How does it make sense to be able to do a bank heist with no response from law enforcement? Banks can give you a lot of money and it would cause too much money to be generated with no effort.

And if your stance on this topic is that being able to rob banks shouldn't be dependent on the amount of cops then it shows you aren't interested about the roleplay involved with bank robberies, you care just care about making as much money as possible. The entire point of anything you do on this server is to enjoy the scenes.

Edited December 16, 2021 by Jett_J

[JohnnydaHo]

51 minutes ago, Jett_J said:

It's still free money for nothing. How does it make sense to be able to do a bank heist with no response from law enforcement? Banks can give you a lot of money and it would cause too much money to be generated with no effort.

And if your stance on this topic is that being able to rob banks shouldn't be dependent on the amount of cops then it shows you don't care about roleplaying, you care just care about making as much money as possible. The entire point of anything you do on this server is to enjoy the scenes.

The RP experience is just as intense and immersive right up until the getaway whether or not cops show up as the robbers do not know how many cops will respond. After the getaway The RP does not stop there and risks exist beyond that of law enforcement in getting the take safe.. in terms of the whole RP scene of a bank robbery, cops have a very short role. I do not see cops complaining about the free money they are getting sitting 8 deep on one stopped motorcycle for 20 minutes while they try to determine whether the rider was involved in a bank robbery that involved bikes. The long cool time period is enough to limit the amount of cash and I doubt if cops get paid less when banks are on cool down.

[Jett_J]

1 hour ago, JohnnydaHo said:

The RP experience is just as intense and immersive right up until the getaway whether or not cops show up as the robbers do not know how many cops will respond. After the getaway The RP does not stop there and risks exist beyond that of law enforcement in getting the take safe.. in terms of the whole RP scene of a bank robbery, cops have a very short role. I do not see cops complaining about the free money they are getting sitting 8 deep on one stopped motorcycle for 20 minutes while they try to determine whether the rider was involved in a bank robbery that involved bikes. The long cool time period is enough to limit the amount of cash and I doubt if cops get paid less when banks are on cool down.

Would it be better for us to sit in a parking lot doing nothing and getting "free money", or would it be better to have everyone not doing something respond to a traffic stop.

Every legal job has down time where there is literally nothing to do and yes they are getting paid for doing nothing but IRL jobs have downtime as well where you can just sit around for a while. 

I also believe that the importance of money is very different when comparing legal characters to non-legal characters. Legal characters really only have use for money when buying a car or house while non-legal characters can buy cars, houses, drug tables, weapons, ingredients etc.

A lot of freelance jobs can make you more money in an hour than a faction job. Every faction's salary starts at 5k an hour while I know I can make about 9k an hour doing bus driving in paleto.

I would disagree which saying the RP experience is the same intensity whether or not a cop shows up. A big part of the experience is having a hostage, negotiating with law enforcement and having them chase you as you attempt to escape with the money you just got from the bank.

Crims can still make "free money" because stores have no limitations when it comes to robbing them and there are plenty of stores in the server.  

[Jett_J]

1 hour ago, Kieran Horn said:

Why are you going after the mans RP ethic? You are taking this far too personal and should not be commenting on whether people want to RP or not. He stated an opposing opinion, he didn't call you a name. 

Am I wrong to say that roleplay is the who point of robbing a bank?

Where is the fun in walking into a bank taking the money and leaving with no risk?