Bala

Personally, I think the struggle comes from it being difficult to pick out the good ideas and the well-meaning community members, from those that just want to specifically benefit themselves and/or their faction. There is a lot of that and unfortunately, it does tend to suffocate the good ideas that people do come up with. It is easy to tar people with the same brush and it tends to be what happens. If you are a criminal, you take the criminal POV. If you are a cop, you take the cop POV. Voting in self-interest is the most natural thing, because why would you vote any other way? But, ultimately, it leads to people picking sides and not to people supporting a common goal. There is a great irony though, that cops rely on criminals and criminals rely on the cops. There is a heavy police involvement in the upper admin teams, you are right but when you look at it, it's also pretty natural. You serve the IC laws and the OOC rules. PD and Staff aren't really that much different so it makes doing both easier. I would like to be honest, I don't think that the interests of our criminal role-players are represented as well as they could be but then at the same time, I don't look at the higher administrators and think they are looking to fuck over a significant portion of the player-base either. For me, it is just that both sides right now are speaking different languages. I'll use the faction war system and the newest robbery rules as examples. Both were introduced because criminals had gotten way out of control with their actions, so the admins respond to protect the interests of other people in the server, which is what you would expect and hope they would do. In doing so, I feel that perhaps too much unpredictability was lost and it lead to more rule-play than role-play. Good Roleplay is not hiding behind the rules nor is it typing fifty /me's. It's about building character and "living" in the world around you. If you have to second guess everything you do, you've already lost it.

It's just a game, where your actions have consequences and risks. It just so happens that PD or SD are your consequences and going to jail is your risk. We are the main danger you face and you are put in that danger by having the option to do whatever you want to do regardless of the law. End of the day, it's not really for us to decide amongst ourselves what's realistic and is not. We're told in PD what we're allowed to use by our faction leader. That faction leader answers to the higher ups in the community and they answer to the founders. I'd expect you to use whatever means you have in game to allow you to evade, so why wouldn't you expect the same of me, you know?

The understanding with the supercars is that we have to respect the fact they cost a lot of money and we don't want to do things that may cause unnecessary damage to a vehicle. There is going off road on relatively easy terrain to drive and there is going up and down mountains. There is a clear distinction. In the report you linked, the 811 did not ram any body, it was hit by the other sheriff cruiser. But then why are you driving a Comet off-road and onto train tracks, then complaining about others, Alberto? As for the helicopter, standard use of them tops them out at about 230-240. If pepjin got his helicopter to 290, he was more than likely doing something that he shouldn't of been. It will only go that fast if you are decreasing altitude significantly (which you aren't in a pursuit, you are more or less the same height, with the front of the helicopter tipped forward slightly) In terms of PD and super cars, you have to have a certain rank and there are a list of vehicles we can deploy the high speed for. But again, they are also unmodded. You might want a PD "nerf" but this is the same server that has the Hakuchou Drag still in circulation. I don't think people bought F620s for the style did they? What about the recent bike debacle? They had to speed cap all the cars, because some of them could 250.. 280.. Threads like this come along every once in a while yet when you ask people the same questions, they offer no real answers. Balancing the server is only a priority if it's in their own personal interest.

I think a rule lives and dies by two things. One, how straight-forward is to follow and Two, what is the reason for it being implemented in a realistic context on an RP server? In terms of the robbery rule, it seems to cite common sense. You can't rob people in places that to do so would put you at too much risk. By extension, that seems to be where a lot of people go. But then you only need to use public transport in some real-life cities and your phone/wallet goes missing, so then is the amount of people really that good of an indicator and if it isn't, what is? Do you go by the amount of players at that location, players that would normally go by that location or do you perhaps go by the assumption that the area would be populated by a lot of people? If it's the first one, robbing a lone farmer on Paul's Farm could be rationalised. If it's the second one, robbing someone along the boardwalk past the mask shop on Vespucci Beach could be rationalised because the concentration of players is on the pier. If it's the third one, if you are then imagining people or things that are not actually there for the player, at what point does that become alternative RP or power-gaming? With my suggestion in this post, I tried to use real-life situations and in-game activity as a guide of where you could rob and where it would make sense. There are high concentrations of players using the Pier, Paleto, Sandy, LS Bank and Legion Square so robbing someone there is too high risk. In-real life, they would be relatively safe. But you start going through Grove Street and those kinds of areas, they're sparsely used and in real life, those kinds of areas are definitely not safe. Chiliad is the same, you are in the middle of nowhere. If you cut the ambiguity surrounding whether a robbery situation is kosher, you cut the reports.

Big -1, agree with below.

Honestly at this point, i just want to be able to remove my tattoo without having to hide it as well.

+1

I'm not sure it was so much the gangs that were doing it, it was the starter criminals, the ones that the bigger gangs robbed. Big gang robs small gang so small gang robs civilians basically. There is a natural order to that, but when there are very little other ways for criminals to indulge that life and make money then they are going to have to resort to robbing people. That issue wasn't addressed and is still a problem, it was just that a rule was made that stopped a lot of the robbery so now there is less ways to make money.

So, the rough idea would be something like this. In-game would look a little like this, it's not massively intrusive, doesn't colour the map or anything like that. In terms of the neighbourhoods (it's the easiest way to do it because these neighbourhoods are already programmed in.) Paleto, Sandy, Legion Square areas would be green zones because of their closeness to police departments. The red zones are either hard to reach areas that typically host trouble anyway OR poor income areas where RPly the crime rate would be high. A rough guide but if they want it to be done properly, then they'd need to sign off on it.

Aw thanks babe, i'll try doing a mockup map so people could see how it would work.

There was an issue before where it did happen way too much, I don't think that can be denied. There needed to be a change. Is the change that happened the right one? I mean, it fixed the problem, but then it did perhaps create problems as well where people are second guessing whether they can actually rob which is no good and people do use the new rules for protection as well. For me, it should be a middle ground situation. You don't want people getting chain robbed, but you also don't want to wrap them in cotton wool either. That's how you end up with snowflake players. For me, the easiest way to do it is to use real life influences. Where would you typically get robbed in real life? Rough neighbourhoods. Remote locations like the Senora Desert. Areas with low police presence. Areas with small foot and vehicle traffic. The chance of getting robbed increases at night. If players are relying on common sense when it comes to robbing than a list of "approved areas" then you'll see more roleplay and less rule-play. Is someone lingering in Davis safe, at any point in the day? Probably not to be honest. Is an oil driller, drilling for oil, safe? In the day, probably. Forget the people working it, it's pretty visible from the roads too. At night though? it's a remote location and it'd be dark so maybe not so much. A little danger is a good thing, for RP. Not just because someone IS robbing you but because you are in a situation where someone MIGHT. If you are smart and use common sense, you won't put yourself in dangerous positions, but if you are greedy or you don't think, you might and then you deserve what you get.

Why you hijacking my thread with your suggestions? I do not consent!

Because of what you have to do in prison and how long to get even $1000.

You do realise you wouldn't be paying more right? You'd be paying the same you pay now. It's just that the people with less money wouldn't have to pay as much. The simple fact is that everyone from Jay Gamble to Derek Neeraj started out as a low life criminal at one point. There are going to be people that get hit with the fines when they commit crimes and don't bother playing again, the less of those, the better for the server and the more criminals to add to the melting pot. In the words of Lucky Luciano, "it's not less, it's more."

This too, important people are at least doing something besides binge watching Netflix shows and doing elementary school mathematics every ten minutes.

Thanks Devonte. Just think it's one of those things where we don't want to kill off characters before they've even got going.

As a cop in the server, I've put away my fair share of criminals into jail or prison and I can't help but think on occasion, it's a little bit like double jeopardy. Not only are they going to a place with less role-play opportunity, they are also taking a financial hit when they do it as well. While this might not be an issue for our better situated criminals who already have quite a lot of money behind them, it can really hurt those criminals that are just getting started. For example, if I've been playing here a while and I have say $500,000 in the bank and I get hit with a Felony Evading charge, I'm paying out 1% of my bank. If I've just started and I have scraped together $50,000 in the bank and I get hit with the same charge, I'm paying out 10% of my bank. Which one of those players is more clued up on our criminal system and which one of those players is going to feel the impact more? As a cop, my goal is stop people getting away with committing crimes, not stop them from wanting to attempt them altogether. Crime is a currency for our law enforcement factions and arguably more important to us than the money we get paid and we rely on it for our factions. My idea is a simple one, instead of a fixed amount for fines on jail, modify it by a similar system that we use to tax people's salary For example, if someone is in the highest tax bracket, you charge them the standard fine amount on imprisonment but if they are in the lower brackets, you discount it accordingly. If someone has 35% tax for example, they pay $5,000 for Felony Evading. If they are a new player, they pay $2,500. The other tax brackets would be reductions from the standard amount. I'm not advocating for change in the fines as fine prices are an IC issue, but adding a script modifier for them based on a player's circumstances would make even a small difference to a lot of people on the server.

The idea is basically, when you take a report from someone, it gives them an audio prompt, like a ding or a jingle or something. Sometimes when you call an older report from someone that's been open for a while, the reporter has forgot about the report. It would help draw their attention back to the report.

"Light" and "Striplight" both do it.

I'm not really sure it's our place to be discussing bans issued out by the admin or development teams. Don't want to be a dick about it, but we have a ban appeals section for a reason just like we have an anti-cheat for a reason. What I will say is that, the only benefit I can see that the server has by banning people who cheat is protecting the rest of the player-base. Names were not picked out of a hat, they were flagged and duly banned. Not sure there's much else to discuss

If the gun is holstered, it's in a holster, secure. Falling to the floor shot wouldn't release it from the holster. Same goes with the heavies. The idea is that they're slung on your back with a strap to get it in place and that wouldn't release on you falling to the floor either. -1.

-1 Personally, I think it makes more sense to improve the areas that people naturally want to go to than trying to make a dead area more relevant.

I wasn't part of the staff team when the rule change was introduced but in my opinion, it was introduced as a last resort because criminals were unable to control themselves when and where they were robbed. You'd have miners, farmers, people at the butchers, people in clothing stores getting robbed and it gets stupid for those not in big groups where they are being forced out of the server. Simple fact is, if we keep it IC, as a cop I'm telling you there is only so many cases we can investigate at one time. Between the gang war, the bank and store robberies, the new player pursuits, answering 911 calls, assisting MD with their calls, answering the impound, processing suspects and answering questions at the LSPD desk.. we cannot keep enough people safe. In an ideal world, I agree with you, it would be nice to not have to resort to extensive measures to control robbery but they're in place for the server we have, not the server that maybe we want. Can't really compare PD and Criminals though. We have different roles within the server. We're a reactive faction and we have a lot more rules and guidelines for what we do. Criminals have the freedom to do what they want, when they want to do it. There is an unfortunate culture in the community where either people are looking to 'win' over their enemies by getting them into admin trouble OR deciding for themselves what they are willing to take part in and not letting situations play out. I don't know both sides of the situation you've referenced so I can't offer an opinion on that, but since I've started assisting in reports, I've noticed it more. the "Save POV" culture I like to call it. For me, that stuff is worse than ruleplay. Gang wars and conflicts being fought in the report section, rather than in-game. I was in WCA for a couple weeks, way back and what struck me from being in the PD is that you cannot act in the moment as a criminal. You have to be very careful with what you do and when you do it because it can quite easily constitute a rule break and inevitably, that leads to people playing to not break a rule than to roleplay. It can be things as stupid as, driving a certain speed constantly because you know you can't be put under Fear RP because you're moving but not actually making a chance to get away. - - - This thread is about robbery rules though. Personally, I think the staff team have done what they felt they needed to, but perhaps there is another solution? In Eve Online, they have a Security Level for certain star systems. Basically the idea is that some areas are more secure than others. We have in our server, the NCZs but elsewhere on the map, there are certain areas that are more dangerous than others. I feel like while there would still be some restraints on this, there is more realism to the idea. So my suggestion is that we designate each area as either a Red, Yellow or Green zone. Green zones would be zones where crimes that draw attention i.e. robberies, murders etc.. would not be permitted at all. These would be legal job locations/dropoffs, clothing stores, legal faction places of employment, LS City/Paleto Town Gas Stations, barber shops etc.. Yellow Zones would be zones where crimes that draw attention i.e. robberies, murders etc.. wouldn't be allowed during the daylight hours (IG 8am-8pm) These would be most of the areas of the map. It makes a lot of roleplay sense for crime rates to spike at night and for police departments to be more alert when it's dark. It's also common sense, so it would be quite easy for the less experienced players to understand. Once it starts getting dark in a yellow zone, the idea being that if you're not a criminal you'll need to take more care when being in those areas. Red zones would be zones where there would be no limitations on crimes that draw attention aside from the other server rules. These would be areas that specialise in illegality such as the gang NPCs, drug labs, chop shops etc.. If you are in these areas, you are there for an illegal reason anyway so it make sense. I think there has to be certain exceptions, for players that shouldn't be robbed no matter what. New players. Players doing legal jobs such as Mining, Fishing at the Pier, Oil, Money Transport etc.. Mechanics, MD, Taxi Drivers and Weazel News - they're performing either life saving or helpful functions for everyone and not taking any sides. Law Enforcement - I'm not saying this because I don't want to get robbed, I never have anything useful anyway but there is not really a reward big enough to make the risk worth it. As how would people know what's what, pretty simple. At the bottom left of the screen near the map, a small coloured dot next to the area. If you are engaged in an RP inside a red zone or a yellow zone after dark, you can still be robbed as the situation would be a continuation. Something like that.

-1 I was never a fan of the whole human meat thing. It was vague what exactly the meat was.. was it a finger? a heart? It also seems pretty memey that people are running around gutting people after a shootout and selling their enemies body parts.

I mean, that's something that would be more suggestion worthy tbh.