Make body armor visible while in your inventory.

[HobGoblin]

The current weapon system makes your weapons (both in loadout and inventory) visible to other players. Body armor currently only shows if the armor is equipped under 'clothing'.

 

My suggestion is to make body armor like the weapon system, showing the body armor at all times if it's in your inventory. Players can counter this how they counter the visible weapons (clothing, vehicles, bags).

[alexalex303]

this makes sense

[jason]

+1, makes sense.

[inorigj]

-1

Bodyarmor is applied like clothes. And just like clothes, do not show on your person unless worn. It would also appear as If you're under it's protection if it showed without actually being used.

 

Making it very odd visual wise. 'its big and wouldn't fit in your pocket"

 

Ah yes fit in my pocket together with my fishing rod. Or my speaker. Or my oil drum. 

 

Yes I know it applies an effect to the player that helps you resist damage. But the amount of damage that the vest blocks is close to NON. Far from enough to make it worth advertising that you carry one without having it on your chest.

[Quietthecutie]

1 hour ago, inorigj said:

-1

Bodyarmor is applied like clothes. And just like clothes, do not show on your person unless worn. It would also appear as If you're under it's protection if it showed without actually being used.

 

Making it very odd visual wise. 'its big and wouldn't fit in your pocket"

 

Ah yes fit in my pocket together with my fishing rod. Or my speaker. Or my oil drum. 

 

Yes I know it applies an effect to the player that helps you resist damage. But the amount of damage that the vest blocks is close to NON. Far from enough to make it worth advertising that you carry one without having it on your chest.

Regarding the argument of it not fitting in your pocket like a fishing rod etc:

the gameplay balance of anything that might offer you an advantage in a fight has always been different than other items in your inventory, this is why any weapon is proudly displayed on your hip/back. i can store 10 fishing rods in my pockets, and whatever else. no one cares cus in a fight, it wont help me. this is a gameplay balance decision, its nothing to do with realisim.

the Armor having next no no impact in a fight argument:

While i have no evidence to support this claim, because i dont know the math, based on footage i have seen and bullets i have taken i believe this to not be true. body armor is basically an extension of your healthbar in a fight, therefore it is EXTREEMELY useful. being able to take 2-5 more bullets in a gunfight can make all the difference in winning or losing, which has knock on effects to everyone else involved. so yeah, AP is pretty powerful which is why its priced and procured at a suitably expensive rate.

TLDR; comparing body armour to  fishing rods or clothing items is nonsensical in the framing that this is a videogame and its a PVP item, like a gun.

[Rage.]

i can see the point from a realistic side, but like inorigj said, wouldn't really make sense. if it's in your pockets and shown on your body, you won't get any benefits from the armor such as, the main reason, protection. why have it show if it's not going to give any benefits. unless having the armor anywhere in your pocket equals it being equipped, would just be an odd change.

unless somehow armor can be modified to be under your shirt (which probably won't happen) and is able to be concealed a bit better and not someone going past at 100 km/h can see it perfectly, this just doesn't make much sense to me and is just yet again just another huge nerf to crims. 

however, if the weight of the armor drops again (which i already know it was just recently dropped from 20 to 10), i am inclined to +1 this as it would be easier to store it.

-1

[Billy Valentine]

Doesn't make sense to have the body armor show at all times but have the body armor not protect you from anything unless dragged into the actual slot alongside your clothing items. 
 

2 hours ago, inorigj said:

Ah yes fit in my pocket together with my fishing rod. Or my speaker. Or my oil drum.

This is a very good point in my opinion. If body armor became visible at all times, you might as well make any oversized item that wouldn't fit in your pockets realistically show on your character at all time. I'm not sure about everyone else but I feel that, that would look very bad.

-1, better luck next time.

Edited October 6, 2024 by Billy Valentine

[inorigj]

22 minutes ago, Quietthecutie said:

body armor is basically an extension of your healthbar in a fight

Yes. It extends your healthbar

 But you left out the critical part where. It does ONLY extend your health when EQUIPPED. Having it show while not extending your healthbar is counter produktive and is feeding the Enemy false information. If i see someone with bodyarmor. I expect them to take more hits. But if they aren't actually wearing it in their armour slot. It's just visual for no reason.

 

It should only be visible when affecting the user. To advertise to others that "I have more health then normal right now"

[tangy]

-1 I believe most tweaks should both benefit either side in some way, this change would just "nerf" crim and just make for more frustration rather than making for new or different RP, it would also making the ordeal of using body Armor just feel extremely clunky if I'm having to go into a bag or into the boot of my car every single time. While it does make sense from a "Realism" standpoint not everything about a video game needs to be realistic, The only way I see this working is if it has a massive price reduction alongside a weight one.

[inorigj]

30 minutes ago, Quietthecutie said:

its a PVP item, like a gun

If we were to show all PVP items on our person at all times. Equiped or not. Then we've ruined SO much RP for crime players. I hope I don't need to remind you. It's an RP server and not a PVP server. 

We show guns on our person to balance the power of them. As at one point. You could pull up on someone and suddenly hold a fully loaded AK on your hands from no where. That's it.

 

I've never heard the complaint "that guy pulled bodyarmor out of his ass"

Because comparing a weapon to protecting from weapons is not realistic. Makes no sense, sorry.

 

And I was comparing it to fishing rods to shutdown the argument "you wouldn't be able to hide it" before anyone made it

[Demonmit1]

-1 it should only be visible when its actively equipped. 

just make an equip timer with an anim, maybe forcing you to stand still for that timer to equip it, along with a /me pink text that shows up over a players head saying they're actively putting armor on. 

[Rage.]

35 minutes ago, Demonmit1 said:

along with a /me pink text that shows up over a players head saying they're actively putting armor on. 

yeah, i beg to just add back the ame above your head that was originally there (eg. equips armor (100)). unsure as to why that was ever changed to looking like you just took off a piece of clothing

 

[Quietthecutie]

58 minutes ago, inorigj said:

If we were to show all PVP items on our person at all times. Equiped or not. Then we've ruined SO much RP for crime players.

Thats exactly what we do for every PVP item that isnt a blunt or (currently) AP.

Again, its nothing to do with realism, whilst this isnt a PVP server ,its a RP server with PVP elements, and those elements need rules regarding them, this is again, why, you cant currently have a weapon concealed on your person. you can conceal them in a bag, glovebox or other storage area. The suggestion is to have AP, which lets be honest youll never have on your person unless youre also armed) also fall under this. it makes sense from a PVP gameplay perspective.

 

1 hour ago, inorigj said:

Yes. It extends your healthbar

 But you left out the critical part where. It does ONLY extend your health when EQUIPPED.

I can only fire my gun when its equipped and ive pulled it out. so why is it Germaine that when i have a gun in my "pockets" its clearly visible and theres also a delay with equipping and pulling it out, but i can instantly slam my AP on and invisibly add a significant ammount to my healthpool?

[inorigj]

1 hour ago, Quietthecutie said:

I can only fire my gun when its equipped and ive pulled it out

Yes, that's my point exactly. You don't seem to understand that you just spoke against your own point.

 

You can only use your gun when equipped and pulled out. At that point. I'll see it in your hands.

If I see it I'm your hands. I know you got it equipped.

 

If I see you with a vest on. I know you've got it equipped.

 

If they made it so the vest is visible. But NOT covering your chest. It's a different story.

 

The entire thing here. Is that if the armour APPEARS to be protecting you. It SHOULD be protecting you. Not just LOOK like it is protecting you.

 

A super important thing in a PVP "perfective" is visual ques. If you're protected by the Kevlar. We should see it. If you're NOT protected by it. We should see that as well. Not wonder if that kevlar is in your pocket or ON you

Edited October 6, 2024 by inorigj

[alexalex303]

2 hours ago, inorigj said:

--

This is a wholly reductive argument. It protects you from what? Damage. 

Scroll through the player report section can you can see a good amount of clips of people just pulling out a shotgun, equipping body armor and hopping out. They are pulling the kevlar out of their ass, and they're using it offensively. Just because it's a defensive item doesn't mean that you can't use it offensively.

If the argument is that kevlar isn't protecting you, therefore it isn't showing, that's fine, we can make it so that if you have kevlar in your inventory, it's always equipped and always protecting you. Perfectly balanced. But you shouldn't have a backup healthbar in your inventory that you can pull out at will and no one can see.

[Danny_V]

-1

if anything, weapons (smaller caliber pistols/knives) should not show on your person if they're in your pockets.
 

Edited October 6, 2024 by Danny_V

[padpilot]

On 10/6/2024 at 11:37 AM, Danny_V said:

-1

if anything, weapons (smaller caliber pistols/knives) should not show on your person if they're in your pockets.
 

-1

yeah this. Still makes zero sense to have such weapons show.

[astrx]

On 10/6/2024 at 11:37 AM, Danny_V said:

if anything, weapons (smaller caliber pistols/knives) should not show on your person if they're in your pockets.

Yeah, no. All weapons should show as well as the original post regarding body armour.
 

+1 to the original suggestion as this makes more sense than not showing.

[tuccci]

+1

The argument of "If its in my pockets but showing - I don't get AP"

 

um yeah? similar to how you have a gun in your pocket but can't pull it because it's not in your weapon slot?

and then you drag it to the useable slot and then poof - it's useable

 

You gotta so some wild mental gymnastics to explain why the invisible Kevlar makes sense and shouldn't follow the same visibility rules as weapons.

The real question is why you have it on you if you weren't planning to use it. 

[inorigj]

2 hours ago, tuccci said:

um yeah? similar to how you have a gun in your pocket but can't pull it because it's not in your weapon slot?

ok let me blow your mind,

you can't pull out the gun yes, because its not equipped.

but do you know where your gun is when not equipped? your pockets, and not your hands. because its not equipped.

just like the bodyarmor. its not on your chest. if its not equipped.

if they added the flat bodyarmor model to your character somewhere, to show that you've got it with you, but not ON you. thats a huge +1. but it SHOULDN'T by any means, be on your chest.

On 10/6/2024 at 6:30 AM, alexalex303 said:

we can make it so that if you have kevlar in your inventory, it's always equipped and always protecting you. Perfectly balanced

This would fix it BUT, what if you're carrying several vests? would that person suddenly have a HUGE healthbar?

[tuccci]

2 hours ago, inorigj said:

ok let me blow your mind,

you can't pull out the gun yes, because its not equipped.

but do you know where your gun is when not equipped? your pockets, and not your hands. because its not equipped.

just like the bodyarmor. its not on your chest. if its not equipped.

i

A weapon shows on your hip (and is RPLY on your hip) wether it's in your pocket/holster slot. its obviously less useful in your pocket.

The same logic should apply to Armor. 

In pocket = showing but not effective

In slot = both showing  and effective

[inorigj]

1 hour ago, tuccci said:

A weapon shows on your hip (and is RPLY on your hip) wether it's in your pocket/holster slot. its obviously less useful in your pocket.

The same logic should apply to Armor. 

In pocket = showing but not effective

In slot = both showing  and effective

I fail to see the logic here. I don't understand how you can compare a weapon on your hip to a bulletproof vest on your chest.

a gun on your hip isn't hurting or threating anyone

a vest on your chest SHOULD be protecting you. its a very basic concept. live I've said before. If its to be shown it should NOT be on your chest. hanging on your back. carried in your hand like a suitcase/bag whatever, but not shown on your chest as if you're wearing protection. because, you're not.

 

this is elementary school logic we're disguising in here. what is going on????

I'm sorry to be getting this rude but come on, this is getting ridicules. yes, @alexalex303 has a point when he say that you shouldn't be able to pull a second health bar from your pockets. but it shouldn't show on your person AS IF you're currently having an extended health bar if you're not.

 

Visual que sure. but not ON YOUR CHEST, its not that hard to understand the logic of this 

[Billy Valentine]

2 hours ago, tuccci said:

A weapon shows on your hip (and is RPLY on your hip) wether it's in your pocket/holster slot. its obviously less useful in your pocket.

The same logic should apply to Armor. 

In pocket = showing but not effective

In slot = both showing  and effective

At this point you might as well just suggest for them to add body armor into the clothing store just for people to wear and "look cool", the purpose of body armor is to give you a health advantage in almost any situation and that is simply it.

Currently body armor alone is 10 vol meaning it would take up your entire glovebox, if you have body armor on you then you probably have some sort of heavy weapon meaning no matter what you'd have to drive around with either a heavy on your back or body armor on your character, both put you at a severe disadvantage in many situations.

I do not understand why people think this would be a good idea, this is just another thing to nerf crims which in my opinion shouldn't be happening.

[moVex]

8 hours ago, Astrx said:

Yeah, no. All weapons should show as well as the original post regarding body armour.
 

+1 to the original suggestion as this makes more sense than not showing.

I agree with this, +1 from me!

[Demonmit1]

1 hour ago, Billy Valentine said:

Currently body armor alone is 10 vol meaning it would take up your entire glovebox, if you have body armor on you then you probably have some sort of heavy weapon meaning no matter what you'd have to drive around with either a heavy on your back or body armor on your character, both put you at a severe disadvantage in many situations.

this is exactly why this is being suggested. to put crim at a disadvantage, unable to conceal their body armor.

the only way i'd support this is if body armor was drastically reduced in weight, or all vehicle interior storage was rebalanced to be more than "glovebox" and just interior storage space.