Massive Crim Nerf

[raganrogaine]

The fact that import prices and humane chem prices haven't changed, you're paying 2-300 to produce one drug. If all you can make is mostly low end, the drug sells for $400. At this point in time, you're essentially only making a $100 profit. $25k profit for something that takes several hours of logistics, planning, and risk. I have absolutely no interest in doing any crime at the moment. The risk vs reward is what made crime fun. Cops and gov jobs get bonuses all the time. I was GSB, you do your hours and end up with bonuses frequently. Turf decay happens pretty frequently and you have to sell a decent amount every couple days to keep your guy happy. These NPCs aren't just random people, they are necessary for your faction to continue operating. 

[Demonmit1]

Rare occasion I actually agree with @alexalex303

The main benefit of criminal activity selling to the NPC dealers should be order power, not money. Those NPC's work for the cartel, they're not just random money generators. if you want to make money, sell it to someone who needs it for order power. other than that, sounds like its time for your crim to get a day job. when I was high command of a gang, I had a full legal job, and was regularly buying bulk drugs for import power and selling guns for profit while working on the job, getting both salary and side income from criminal activity. 

Edited June 22, 2025 by Demonmit1

[raganrogaine]

Selling guns being your main source of income does not combat pvp mentality in the slightest

[Nicholas Palermo]

6 hours ago, alexalex303 said:

There are many ways to make money as a criminal, selling items to NPCs is the least creative, less helpful for the server and the one lacking the most in roleplay. It should've been reduced a long time ago. Deal with other people, sell them assets and you can decide the price. Interact, build a story, roleplay.

-1

Where is the money coming from to fund these large criminals that is going to supply these great deals? I mean that’s fine and dandy if I want to source 100k of guns and turn around and double the price, minus that that essentially gate keeps all new players from ever reaching that “mogul state” without finding someone to personally bankroll every purchase because they’ve played the game for years before this happened. While yes I agree there should be more role play, it’s easily achievable through alt-rps to make highly interactive scenarios that can involve pd/sd and criminals. 
 

I’ll keep pushing I think this has to do a lot more with the risk reward than just “give me give money me money”. While everyone can argue this is going to balance things that doesn’t take away from the massive increase of people who just straight up quit over this that we’re trying to fix.

[Earl Mud]

That's the core issue is risk vs reward. No until max level legal job nets you more money with 0 risk. Several crims are on hiatus till something is done. This affects legals too cause cops will have less rp and mechanics will now have less people to get repairs since most of the people getting repairs were crims since they need them way more often than legals. 

[NotKempi]

I'm confused, or perhaps missing something 
The Pawn Shop by default pays out 75% of an item's value. Any burglary perks increasing that up to 100% is a buff; you also get buffs for the noise you make and speed of looting, making house robberies much more worth it as your level goes up. 

I do however, find it weird how selling items is the way to get XP here; surely the act of committing the burglary should be what gives you experience.

Robbery perks are also just a straight buff, giving you more and faster rewards. 

The criminal tree also offers straight buffs with no drawbacks, lowering your jail sentence, lowering the chance of fingerprints being left, and giving you increased war points. 

Overall besides the nerf to drugs, this seems like a buff to me, offering criminals a way to get better payouts for what they specialize in. Even then, drugs having different qualities open up new avenues of roleplay. If you don't want to spend the time learning how to make top-tier drugs, you need to find a supplier of them, or if you learn how to make top-tier drugs, you can use that as leverage in deals. 

[GGDude91]

21 minutes ago, NotKempi said:

I'm confused, or perhaps missing something 
The Pawn Shop by default pays out 75% of an item's value. Any burglary perks increasing that up to 100% is a buff; you also get buffs for the noise you make and speed of looting, making house robberies much more worth it as your level goes up. 

I do however, find it weird how selling items is the way to get XP here; surely the act of committing the burglary should be what gives you experience.

Robbery perks are also just a straight buff, giving you more and faster rewards. 

The criminal tree also offers straight buffs with no drawbacks, lowering your jail sentence, lowering the chance of fingerprints being left, and giving you increased war points. 

Overall besides the nerf to drugs, this seems like a buff to me, offering criminals a way to get better payouts for what they specialize in. Even then, drugs having different qualities open up new avenues of roleplay. If you don't want to spend the time learning how to make top-tier drugs, you need to find a supplier of them, or if you learn how to make top-tier drugs, you can use that as leverage in deals. 

Yeah all of that is cool but the issue is now i gotta work on making the same amount of money i made for a year, why? Yeah ill eventually do it faster but wasting a year and earning pennies or even coming out at a major loss due to PD, rivals, a random glitch(lag spike, etc...) and not have enough money to do the jobs is a definite issue.

Edited June 22, 2025 by GGDude91

[NotKempi]

10 minutes ago, GGDude91 said:

Yeah all of that is cool but the issue is now i gotta work on making the same amount of money i made for a year, why? Yeah ill eventually do it faster but wasting a year and earning pennies or even coming out at a major loss due to PD, rivals, a random glitch(lag spike, etc...) and not have enough money to do the jobs is a definite issue.

What jobs are you referring to? House Robberies? AFAIA Scratched Furniture always has sold for 75% of its value to the pawn shop and still does, even at level 0 Burglary. 

[Nicholas Palermo]

27 minutes ago, NotKempi said:

I'm confused, or perhaps missing something 
The Pawn Shop by default pays out 75% of an item's value. Any burglary perks increasing that up to 100% is a buff; you also get buffs for the noise you make and speed of looting, making house robberies much more worth it as your level goes up. 

I do however, find it weird how selling items is the way to get XP here; surely the act of committing the burglary should be what gives you experience.

Robbery perks are also just a straight buff, giving you more and faster rewards. 

The criminal tree also offers straight buffs with no drawbacks, lowering your jail sentence, lowering the chance of fingerprints being left, and giving you increased war points. 

Overall besides the nerf to drugs, this seems like a buff to me, offering criminals a way to get better payouts for what they specialize in. Even then, drugs having different qualities open up new avenues of roleplay. If you don't want to spend the time learning how to make top-tier drugs, you need to find a supplier of them, or if you learn how to make top-tier drugs, you can use that as leverage in deals. 

Hey there! No worries, easy to clear up. The rebuff has been applied to all sales (aside from chopping, I haven’t been able to test it if anyone can fill in there). The pawn shops 45% base sale price, 80% and so on increase is applies to the original 45% sale price. A pair of bolt cutters for example that used to sell for somewhere around 1800, now sells for 950 or so. While yes there is an opportunity to make that original price, it would take months of working doing nothing with your life but playing on ecrp to make it back to what used to be a standard. Therefore it’s not any sort of a buff as compared to what used to be, nor can it be turned into a buff money wise when selling (another we will not be able to test until much later is what the “greatly increased” rewards for a bank for, however this could also mean banks have been debuffed if anyone can chip in there)

You do only earn the xp when completing jobs, not from selling as far as I’ve see , ie interactions inside a house, hotwiring a car, breaking into an atm. Lots of people are reporting and as I’ve seen myself, when we do the math it becomes a very hard motivational struggle to make substantially less just to earn what we used to at a slightly higher speed, and have to struggle with all the normal setbacks of crime and make less money while we’re doing it. 
 

if this was a buff from the original prices, or at least increased from what it is, I think it would fix a lot of issues. But as of currently the risk/reward is so skewed people no longer feel any need to do it.

[Earl Mud]

To add to the price nerf lockpicking is longer now so the buffs at max level just return it to where it was. It's literally full nerf on most crime and at max level with 1000's of hours in it some crime goes back to what it was prior to the changes but only some of it. 

I tested it and also did a report 1 and asked. It's not a buff it's a nerf till max level. The 100% is not an increase it's 100% of the original 45%. And all the lockpicking was nerfed and confirmed that with the buffs at max level just get you where you were before. The only actual buff at all is the fingerprints. So yeah let's make it to where you gotta grind 1000's of hours on each crime just have a buff to fingerprints and nerf some pricing at max level too. 

Edited June 22, 2025 by Earl Mud

[Nicholas Palermo]

5 minutes ago, NotKempi said:

What jobs are you referring to? House Robberies? AFAIA Scratched Furniture always has sold for 75% of its value to the pawn shop and still does, even at level 0 Burglary. 

After testing about 7 crates worth of furniture we were noticing far decreased income, it’s hard to tell with furniture specifically as nobody takes the time to categorize “okay I’m selling a crystal skull and it’s selling for this much” but bolt cutters were one of the few we could see a direct decrease with.

The reason I grouped furniture in with this on my other posts is because prior to the update I had never sold any scratched furniture for less than at least $350, and was selling multiple at around $79-$150 which felt like a pretty noticeable new low.

 

[HeadShot]

51 minutes ago, NotKempi said:

What jobs are you referring to? House Robberies? AFAIA Scratched Furniture always has sold for 75% of its value to the pawn shop and still does, even at level 0 Burglary. 

This isn’t true, house robberies pre update would give 100% of its value, idk how often you hit them but I averaged 2-3 houses every in game night for many weeks and when you right click on the scratched, click use and see the value. That’s what you would get when you sell it, so a piece worth 1734 would sell for 1734 at the pawn shop pre update 

[raganrogaine]

Crims make a lot because they have to spend a lot to further their rp and character development. Cops win it's alright, yall wont have any crims to RP with for a while.

[Marksy]

Just adapt man, this is an RP server, it ain't all about money and assets.

[Perez1025]

8 hours ago, Ritchie Stones said:

i think, gangs now will have to diversify in their members, have part grinders and part pvp, basically you will need people to be able to make good drugs- sellthem, to then import guns from it, to then have your pvp fight in the first place, 
maybe for now atm people can still circumvent it because of their stach but i can see in the next 2 months it will start to dry up.

so adapt QUICKLY is key, as far as my knowledge here goes. i havent played yet so cant confirm 100%
but i think this might actualy balance out the pvp at least for now 

I have to disagree cause why grind hours and hours gather, buying ingredients, cooking drugs when I can roll a lab rob a guy doing all that? I think this crim nerf was gone about the wrong way and while I think drug profit needed a bit of a nerf this massive nerf on all crime is nuts, unless goal is a server of legals then I guess step in right direction.

[Earl Mud]

3 minutes ago, Marksy said:

Just adapt man, this is an RP server, it ain't all about money and assets.

Unless you want to be in debt. The nice thing with the prior profits is you could spend a couple hours grinding then a couple hours RP. Now any crime you will have to grind 4x longer to have money to use for your rp. 

[Marksy]

While we're at it, let's change the turf system and stop it being so asset sell to NPC based, give us like jobs to do for turfs, more things that will create RP 

[Earl Mud]

1 minute ago, Marksy said:

While we're at it, let's change the turf system and stop it being so asset sell to NPC based, give us like jobs to do for turfs, more things that will create RP 

See that I agree with. Let us take more contract style jobs for our crime so we dont have to do the same rotation of chop, steal, cook repeat nonstop. I want the RP for crim to be good but this update doesn't help with that. 

[Vardan Sarkissian]

1 hour ago, Marksy said:

Just adapt man, this is an RP server, it ain't all about money and assets.

It will be all about the money when half of the server will just grind twice as much and rp half as much cause they get less then they used to lol. 

[Vardan Sarkissian]

1 hour ago, Marksy said:

While we're at it, let's change the turf system and stop it being so asset sell to NPC based, give us like jobs to do for turfs, more things that will create RP 

this 100%, nobody is against it

[Joel Julian]

Pretty new to the server, terrible thing I'm reading. I already found that most of the crime tasks were not lucrative enough for the reward you get. Plus you need to consider that as a criminal you risk investment on weapons, gear, food, real estate and vehicles - You risk getting robbed - You risk getting pulled by LEOs

LEOs are super OP on this server I feel like but what can I say I only played it for a week or 2-3

[chadman567]

been here for years. sad to see how this happened and to start from fresh atleast give us some type of benifit

 

[astrx]

What I am getting from this whole thread is "we don't get enough money". The updates are not the issue, all of you are, change your mindset, not everything is about money and assets.

[CalvinKlein]

I saw the pawn shop on 45% today (not sure what it was originally). 

For the drugs (apparently) you need to cook 10 mil worth of drugs, to get to "TOP" quality which sells for the same as your normal drugs before.

So basically everyone who's been cooking, and doesn't do it too often (like me) has to grind it, to make the same amount of money from it that originally did, not even a bonus.

I think for drugs, the potency should only affect duration and effects, making a player to player market for the top quality drugs, and where they're used as utility for fighting, running, whatever.

And the prices to NPCs for the low drugs should be the same prices we're used to, with an increase (that'd be the bonus/buff) if you get to Top tier drugs, or no bonus, just keep same prices, different effects, where having TOP makes those drugs desired by other players.



 

[CalvinKlein]

3 minutes ago, Astrx said:

What I am getting from this whole thread is "we don't get enough money". The updates are not the issue, all of you are, change your mindset, not everything is about money and assets.

I can see why this would be your approach, but also I feel like the focus on "money/assets" isn't the issue, it's rather the fact that there's obviously a lot wrong with crim RP as it stands, and a lot of places that need improvements, and a lot of updates that are needed, with this update being something a bit overdue, the War System specifically is good for Conflict / Gang RP, and not just "clapping" and having an actual story.

Then you have the technical aspect where criminals need to make money to fund that RP / lifestyle, or even to conduct business, given the scale of losses most face, or risk; and with the update it basically took everyone to negative, told them to work their way back up to "Neutral", which promotes more PVP, more Grind, than it does RP.

I personally enjoyed making money the most doing illegal business, supplying guns, etc,. player to player.
All the way from when crims could own gun stores, and I had Liam Gunar sell me .50s for 2k and I went around in City bank Flipping them, I see the points people are making with the "Make more money P2P" but the way things are setup right now (and the past while) makets it harder.

And the skill system taking people to negative is either gonna make people grind more and burn out, or promote a MMO RPG style gameplay.

Criminals have been asking for a buff in pay, and this is great, the update is great, it's just the values that can use rebalancing (Pricing according to quality). And maybe adding something for chops