Official criminal Faction life Vs PD life. ((Criminal orientated suggestion))

[gohena]

I kind of feel that on this server official gangs are too friendly with each other, most major gangs are allied and don't fight over territory or drug labs reason being the only territory to fight over are drug labs and they barely pay anything and requires it to be a team effort and that drastically reduces profits, Legal jobs pay more money then cooking drugs which makes no sense and there is no risk with legal jobs. I am suggesting drug labs should be heavily buffed and made so maybe only official gangs can access them, i think that would make sense, iv'e seen new player tags who just joined the server that are cooking drugs right away and sometimes civilians with no criminal background, Drug labs should have higher payouts and only be able to be accessed by official criminals gangs so big gangs start to fight over control of drug labs, right now on the server literally all major gangs just hold hands with each other and when ever there is a new gang in town they get wiped out instantly for example the monkey gang. The server just feels like it's one giant gang VS PD, which makes sense because PD is very over powered, they get hourly pay and free weapons and heavies plus body armor, that's why gangs are forced to be neutral with each other and not fight each other because they need to save it for PD which it should be more gang Vs gangs trying to control profitable money making areas like drug labs, chop shops ETC. Being a criminal is High Risk with little reward, while being PD is High Rewards with little risk. I feel criminals need a huge buff/boost like more income from illegal activities. Iv'e played both sides of the spectrum being both PD and Crim with over 44 days of play time on the server. Also, maybe gangs should be limited to only a single ally, not multiple allies. Being an a official gang you barely see official gang members cooking at drug labs we literally  just drive from drug lab to drug lab ganking random civilians cooking and when ever there is another major gang cooking nothing ever happens because we are all allied. I kind of feel that the server should start to focus more towards getting gangs to try and fight over profitable territory and not so much like it currently is with most major gangs just holding hands with each other being friendly, in real life that does not happen! gangs are constantly fighting over territory drug routes/money making methods reason being is because it's illegal profitable work! mean while in the server its illegal high risk low paying work especially now with the new jail sentence plus another PD out in the countryside where most drugs labs are located so it's much easier to just go around ganking the randoms and civilians cooking the drugs since there is little risk of getting caught, hence the whole hands up this is a robbery argument on the server.

A while back there was talk about making mobile drug labs? maybe that should be implemented allowing only official criminal factions to be the only ones to import them, which at first will have a steep cost but they will be highly profitable and this will also remove it so civilians can't access drug labs and it's more of an official criminal gang ran operation. Maybe the current drug labs can be left in they will just keep paying the same amount and not as much as having official gang importing their own drug labs and make warehouses actually useful to gangs because let's be honest they are pretty useless for the most part currently.

 

Do you guys have any more suggestions you would like to add on to this or anything else you feel should be addressed?

Edited July 2, 2019 by gohena

[thesilentwrath]

MAJOR +1! this is exactly why i stopped being a criminal it's pointless, boring, and there is no money at all to be made all while risking jail time fines and getting you're car impounded when arrested.

Edited July 2, 2019 by thesilentwrath

[Riderz]

+1 AGREED

[xxxJustTimmy]

Big +1 

[DaniDota]

Civ/PD wise: -1

Crim wise: +1

 

Civ's will want that crim RP dies out/barely exists.

Crims want criminal RP to be more rewarding.

[MarineTipton]

I agree 1000000000000%.

[Skino]

Well said but how do you expect the unofficial upcoming Gangs/ organizations/ Non affiliated people who like to do crime make money if that's the case you want it just for Offical Gang's I kinda like how you put this because you just exposed how boring Offical Gang's are not to mention you can't shoot another Gang Member because he hasn't shot even though he has come to the scene for a reason not saying kill on sight but at least have some more rules that imply you're allowed to do something to them because people abuse this rule too much, be ready and know he's/she is  there and chasing you for a reason I'm sure you have all had it where you're in a chase but can't shoot the guy/girl because he/she is  just simply updating on the radio but they have chosen to join the activity/ arrive at the scene  in the same Mask/Clothing and you can't do shit until he/she pops off/ shoots but you know full well they're Gang affiliated and they're here to kill you because of the current Player you had interactionss with were Affiliated, for instance, you kill a member then five more pull up in the affiliated colored car wearing the same masks/clothing like mentioned surely you know why they're here? maybe worth looking into, if they have no gang affiliations when arraving on scene then fair enough you can't really do anything which is up to the civ/ Gang member to arrive undercover and with no affiliations if something does happen to them file a complaint.. as Gang Member you should know to go to a backup call where your fellow member has been shot is dangerous  n should be ready to die no matter the circumstances otherwise why else would you go to sit and look at the body??. on the other hand why not just suggest making it more profitable for official gangs and suggest a different drop off point instead of just restricting it to official Gang's not saying it will happen but that way people can still cook shit and not be affiliated and can't drop off to the official Gang location or just kinda think of ways to even it out a little I'm sure the server has many ways it can profit official gangs with which still gives others a chance to form a new organization  just an idea like, the Offical Gangs already have their perks but not making much profit due to being allies, Kinda my thought on your thread but who am i to talk.

 

>>>Maybe the current drug labs can be left in they will just keep paying the same amount and not as much as having official gang importing their own drug labs and make warehouses actually useful to gangs because let's be honest they are pretty useless for the most part currently

>>>maybe gangs should be limited to only a single ally, not multiple allies. Being an official gang you barely see official gang members cooking at drug labs we literally just drive from drug lab to drug lab ganking random civilians cooking and whenever there is another major gang cooking nothing ever happens because we are all allied. 

.. Just cut being too friendly and actually gain power through your own organization not saying don't have allies but surely it isn't fun being allies with every single official organization, and not having any COMP then you can fight over drug labs and maybe ask for the spawn time of the products to be faster on a certain hour which then will give you official gangs something to look forward to and prepare also the civ's / no affiliated members will know not to go to the location's at that time, and you only get an Hour to hold it down per drug lab so if 2 gangs have one you have a choice to either attack that and take it or move to the next one and also do a rotation per day who holds it down one gang guarding one gang taking each day the gang will decide who has it on a monday and who has it on a tuesday for example.. but don't forget there are 3 drug labs so each drug lab would be held down for a certain amount of time which then unofficial gangs or a gang that didn't make it on time can raid and attempt to take it first come first serve kinda thing which will also work if you only get 2 allies it would be 2 gangs per drug lab, for instance, they are all full then obiously you have to try to take one which also follows under new life rule as if you get clapped you aint returning to the drug lab, so you best be prepared as you would lose all your valubul guns if you did lose. and if your current allies were packing and you think you could go to another Drug lab alone leaving them to gather and guard themselves this would also give you some comp/fun activitys

 

Edited July 2, 2019 by JayG

[MarineTipton]

If they give the criminals enough shit to live off of, and it's more gang vs gang shit then the civilians will be left alone. If a gang is making 50k an hour (with high risk or whatever) they wont be bothered with robbing all the civilians at foundry. They'll be too busy killing each other over territory. This will also lead to less criminal vs. cop action. Cops aren't meant to be in gun fights every day, it's the gangs that fight. Cops should deal with what they stumble upon or are called to etc.. But it shouldn't be wild west cops vs criminals, it should be criminal vs criminal. 

[Skino]

8 minutes ago, MarineTipton said:

If they give the criminals enough shit to live off of, and it's more gang vs gang shit then the civilians will be left alone. If a gang is making 50k an hour (with high risk or whatever) they wont be bothered with robbing all the civilians at foundry. They'll be too busy killing each other over territory. This will also lead to less criminal vs. cop action. Cops aren't meant to be in gun fights every day, it's the gangs that fight. Cops should deal with what they stumble upon or are called to etc.. But it shouldn't be wild west cops vs criminals, it should be criminal vs criminal. 

Edited July 2, 2019 by JayG

[gohena]

42 minutes ago, MarineTipton said:

If they give the criminals enough shit to live off of, and it's more gang vs gang shit then the civilians will be left alone. If a gang is making 50k an hour (with high risk or whatever) they wont be bothered with robbing all the civilians at foundry. They'll be too busy killing each other over territory. This will also lead to less criminal vs. cop action. Cops aren't meant to be in gun fights every day, it's the gangs that fight. Cops should deal with what they stumble upon or are called to etc.. But it shouldn't be wild west cops vs criminals, it should be criminal vs criminal. 

Yep, i really hope they start to implement stuff like this.

[jerryman]

 "I am suggesting drug labs should be heavily buffed and made so maybe only official gangs can access them, i think that would make sense"

-1

[Riderz]

How about we make "labs" accessible to unofficial; and imported labs by official 

[Ezrya]

completely agree +1

[kP20]

+1

This is more like a illegal job lol.

Remove those places where you can sell drugs, let them sell it at players in a ic way. This system which is done makes no sense at all. It's just a drug party for gangs.

Edited July 2, 2019 by kP20

[thiggins19]

Gohena, I +1 a lot of this except drug labs being official only. As of right now the only criminal activities you can really do are robbing, chop shop and drugs, drugs being the most consistent if you aren't robbed. My belief is that drug labs need boosting for money, have more drug labs available, like trap houses in the cities. If drug labs were made official only, everyone is going to be lining up to be in a official gang, making the war for territory pointless as two gangs will become so big they'll just Ally. As for the gangs not fighting, is that not partially the gangs fault? They came up with the counsel and all allied with each other, maybe you could ICly change that if you want war.

+1 for boost to crim rp

+1 for trying to turn the server back into gang Vs gang

+1 for saying PD is OP.

-1 for drug labs being official only

 

[Tim Fullerman]

1 hour ago, kP20 said:

+1

This is more like a illegal job lol.

Remove those places where you can sell drugs, let them sell it at players in a ic way. This system which is done makes no sense at all. It's just a drug party for gangs.

The problem with only selling to players ICly are that the drugs provide little to no benefit for personal use, there is no market for drugs like there is irl. There still has to be an artificial drop off location to sell drugs or else that would make crim rp that much worse.

[gohena]

27 minutes ago, Tim Fullerman said:

The problem with only selling to players ICly are that the drugs provide little to no benefit for personal use, there is no market for drugs like there is irl. There still has to be an artificial drop off location to sell drugs or else that would make crim rp that much worse.

they provide no benefit at all other then bad side affects and make your game unplayable with affects lol

[alexalex303]

I agree the criminals need more script support, but the IC diplomacy is forged IC and I'm somewhat weary of changing it due to OOC reasons.

[nikolay69]

HUGE +1

[Alverin]

Here's what needs to happen to improve the Crime Roleplay on the server

Drugs

Drugs need a overhaul in how they are valued. Currently they're mostly valued as an asset to be sold to a waypoint. We don't want that. We want players to interact as much as humanly possible because that creates intense, dramatic and REAL situations. So we need to remove the Waypoints.

I'll type it again REMOVE THE WAYPOINTS. No more drug drop offs for money. Make the DRUGS consumable by CHARACTERS. More importantly give them a REASON to consume the drugs. Now you have a MARKET.

"Well how do we make drugs desirable? If we remove the waypoints they'll be totally useless, there's no reason to even make them then. It's already been done (to an extent) make them give armor. Now we've got a GOOD reason to buy drugs. Cocaine gives a tinsy winsy bit of armor right now, why would we risk selling that to a player when you can sell it safely to a waypoint for possibly more money? Well here's my quickly written up drug system that will blow your socks off and make you say "Damn I want some COCAINE RIGHT NOW. AND I WANT TO SELL IT TO OTHER PEOPLE"

Example: Coke gives some sort of invasive visual effect but gives you 50% armor right away. The second time you use it it gives you 45% armor because you've developed a TOLERANCE to it. Thus the MORE OFTEN you take cocaine the less of a buff it gives to you. So what do you do? You try different drugs of course! Well Weed is easier to make so it's cheaper, but it still gives 15% the first time you use it, so you go smoke some weed. You develop a tolerance to that too, so you swap drugs again.

What this does is infinitely increases the demand for drugs and makes every drug increase in demand based on needs. Weed is a little more legal than other drugs, it's easier to make and it has a less powerful visual effect. So that's for the lighties, people who just want a little extra protection at not a huge cost. Coke is more hardcore but you build up a tolerance way quicker, so you use it when you really have to or when you're gunna get into some shit soon to get you amped and ready.

This system ALSO perpetuates my personal idea of "Value the New" Value the New is a guideline I strive for in which new players are valued by older, established players. The newer you are the more likely it is you haven't done any drugs SO they effect you better than say, Joe_Blow who's done every drug under the sun like 100 times each and now to get full armor he has to do some crazy fucked up formula consisting of 3 weeds, 4 cocaines, 9 meths and 2 LSD's to max out his armor. Joe Blow is gunna value having a soldier who can do two hits of cocaine and be ready to fight, because it costs less to get him ready to fight. So now instead of excluding newer players in the criminal world, they're welcomed and fought over like a valuable resource. This creates CONFLICT and COMPETITION. More importantly it makes NEW PLAYERS feel REALLY GOOD about playing on the SERVER. These are all very important.

Ideally, more hardcore drugs would give more armor but you'd build up a tolerance faster, they'd be more illegal and finally they'd give more invasive vision impairments while under their influence. We could even put cigarettes and alcohol on this list. NOW WE'VE GOT A REASON TO SIT AROUND AND SMOKE AND TALK. While we slowly but surely build up our armor in case something crazy happens.

Additionally, drug production needs to be limited in some fashion. If I understand it correctly as is, there are certain drug labs around LS that produce different drugs. What could be done is these drug labs produce different drugs each, so controlling them could become an important endeavor. This might lead to talks about who gets to produce what type of drug and perhaps combined distribution processes. Now that distribution is a factor, (getting drugs to different people) it may be important to develop contacts with "plugs" for your drugs and to secure certain locations as dealing spots for drugs. This introduces an additional layer to the drug market and makes it strictly interactive. Now that we finally have stacking prison sentences it will be important to burden other people with the distribution, making it it's own little "job". Because if your cook is the one selling drugs your production will stop once he gets arrested.

Also, creation of drugs needs to cost something, someone told me it only took "time" to create drugs, it didn't cost anything. The problem with this is it can cause deflation and we'll have too many drugs, drugs should ultimately be a money sink for every consumer. So money shouldn't be CREATED by drugs it should be DESTROYED by drugs. This makes drugs more valuable as an asset and commodity and improves the economy on the server (which seems like it suffers from inflation).

Weapons

Weapons really need a fix. "Ordering" them from outside sources and having them dropped off is a neat idea but again the only interaction that happens is on the back end. What you need are assets that can be possessed such as (A Materials, B Materials, C Materials and D Materials) and each weapon requires different materials to craft it and it also requires a certain "level" to craft it. I know this isn't an RPG but hear me out, because the level is crucial. First let's talk about why we have different materials. Each material is like a puzzle piece, let's take an ak-47 for example. In my model it might take something like 800 A Mats, 200 B Mats and 350 C mats to make an AK-47 and you'd have to be level 3 to craft it. So you're in the Zetas and they control the A Materials Pick-Up as well as the A Materials Drop-Off.  Awesome, you pick up 4 packs of A Materials (because you're level 4 and you can pick up 1 pack per level) and you drop them off now you have 400 mats, rinse and repeat and you've got your 800 A Mats. Now you wanna get your 200 B mats but the Zetas don't really run around the B mats pickup OR drop off, but it's mostly up for grabs right now, so you go to the pick up and pick up the 200 and go to the drop off and when you get to the drop off there's some Wanted members there to tax you. You either pay the tax or fight them, whatever. But now you start to see how interaction between gangs work. Maybe the Zetas have something worked out with the Wanted where they can pick up the mats. Maybe the wanted Sell access to the mats. Maybe the Wanted sell the MATS outright to anyone that wants them, but doesn't let anyone use the drop off. Whatever the case be you have to TALK to players and interact with them. Finally you get all your mats together and because you're high enough level you craft the AK-47 after spending 15k on Materials and you're ready to go out and sell it for 25k.

Now earlier I said the XP was crucial, well why is it crucial besides being a system for progression? Here's the kicker, here's something that really ties all of this stuff together, it's loseable. That's right, you can LOSE XP in crafting. How do you lose it? Through death of course. Now that NLR really comes into effect. Why should it be loseable? That sounds like a lot of hard work down the drain, BECAUSE it increases the STAKES something that NEEDS to exist in Criminal RP. It makes the fact that someone killed your best weapon crafter that much worse. It makes people who put this work in AND STAY ALIVE more valuable and it makes targeted hits on certain organizations MUCH more POWERFUL. It makes things more dramatic, serious and REAL. When someone takes out one of your top crafters you suddenly can't craft AK-47's anymore until he's re-crafted all these other tiny guns and got his XP back. What do all of these suggestions have in common? They allow players to INTERACT. Some of them even FORCE players to interact. That's what we want. We want to give everyone a reason to INTERACT.

Fix The Economy

Seriously I feel like I'm living in fuckin Zimbabwe while playing on this server sometimes, a fishing rod costs 1700 for God's sake. What's up with the economy on the server? We need MORE money sinks, not COSTLIER ones. Why do 10 cheeseburgers cost more than some peoples vehicles? Also can we get some nicer looking jewelry that's crazy expensive? We need more shit for the extremely rich folk to spend their money on. Like a 200k diamond studded chain or a 90k bezel wrist watch. My other suggestions are to make cars not only cost more but have the cost of the car applied to insurance premiums. Like for example, let's say your premium is 150 per paycheck base, for insurance on your car. If you lose your car or it gets destroyed, the premium goes up and you pay extra in the form of a percentage of how much damage you did until it's paid off. So if you have a 20,000 car, that's cool but owning a 20,000 car is more costly than just the gas you pay for it. If you wreck or lose your car, you then accumulate 200 in debt every paycheck until the 20,000 for the car that has been automatically replaced for you is replaced. And that's another money sink. So you lose your car 3 times you're losing 600 a paycheck for the next 100 paychecks or 200 a paycheck for the next 300 paychecks (maybe give them a choice). This way we don't have gangsters driving cars over hills and flipping them, ect. Give cars "healthbars" or something so you can assess damage on them and if they're repaired by insurance you pay that percent in the cars original cost in premiums. I have a million other idea's for fixing the economy, a lot of them are harsh but increase the games fidelity over all. But the Economy HAS TO BE FIXED for people to start taking things seriously and really having a fun time. There has to be risk and reward and a ladder to climb. Right now it's just too much like a sandbox with rules that prohibit you from MASS DMing.

TL;DR I've got a lot of idea's that are more easily explained over voicechat, if you want me expound on anything quicker and more accurately than typing, hit me up on discord and I'll give you the run down on how to craft a successful game like this. (I've been developing games for over 9 years but just 3 years ago began taking the craft seriously.)

 

 

 

[alexalex303]

14 minutes ago, Alverin said:

-snip-

Hey.

I don't think a reaction would be enough compared to all the effort you put into this. I appreciate it, and you. Thank you for taking the time to write all that.

Edited July 2, 2019 by alexalex303

[Riderz]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

11

1 hour ago, Alverin said:

 

Fix The Economy

Seriously I feel like I'm living in fuckin Zimbabwe while playing on this server sometimes, a fishing rod costs 1700 for God's sake. What's up with the economy on the server? We need MORE money sinks, not COSTLIER ones. Why do 10 cheeseburgers cost more than some peoples vehicles? Also can we get some nicer looking jewelry that's crazy expensive? We need more shit for the extremely rich folk to spend their money on. Like a 200k diamond studded chain or a 90k bezel wrist watch. My other suggestions are to make cars not only cost more but have the cost of the car applied to insurance premiums. Like for example, let's say your premium is 150 per paycheck base, for insurance on your car. If you lose your car or it gets destroyed, the premium goes up and you pay extra in the form of a percentage of how much damage you did until it's paid off. So if you have a 20,000 car, that's cool but owning a 20,000 car is more costly than just the gas you pay for it. If you wreck or lose your car, you then accumulate 200 in debt every paycheck until the 20,000 for the car that has been automatically replaced for you is replaced. And that's another money sink. So you lose your car 3 times you're losing 600 a paycheck for the next 100 paychecks or 200 a paycheck for the next 300 paychecks (maybe give them a choice). This way we don't have gangsters driving cars over hills and flipping them, ect. Give cars "healthbars" or something so you can assess damage on them and if they're repaired by insurance you pay that percent in the cars original cost in premiums. I have a million other idea's for fixing the economy, a lot of them are harsh but increase the games fidelity over all. But the Economy HAS TO BE FIXED for people to start taking things seriously and really having a fun time. There has to be risk and reward and a ladder to climb. Right now it's just too much like a sandbox with rules that prohibit you from MASS DMing.

TL;DR I've got a lot of idea's that are more easily explained over voicechat, if you want me expound on anything quicker and more accurately than typing, hit me up on discord and I'll give you the run down on how to craft a successful game like this. (I've been developing games for over 9 years but just 3 years ago began taking the craft seriously.)

 

 

 

Some of these idea(s) are good now relating to vehicles being lost and you must pay it's a little far. Unless you are also agreeing to PD cars being chop-able and they can subtract pay from the officers who withdraw it and get it destroyed. Drugs, It was tried before and before and the market "Idea" dies everyone time since the ideas in place are to virtually eliminate criminal violence. Thus rendering the drug useless. You want all these restrictions on criminals, but you do not factor the most important part, what's the counterbalance to help gangs. 

[Alverin]

8 minutes ago, Tezhl said:

Some of these idea(s) are good now relating to vehicles being lost and you must pay it's a little far. Unless you are also agreeing to PD cars being chop-able and they can subtract pay from the officers who withdraw it and get it destroyed. Drugs, It was tried before and before and the market "Idea" dies everyone time since the ideas in place are to virtually eliminate criminal violence. Thus rendering the drug useless. You want all these restrictions on criminals, but you do not factor the most important part, what's the counterbalance to help gangs. 

I don't understand how the drug idea was tried and failed. You said "The market 'Idea' dies everyone time since the ideas in place are to virtually eliminate criminal violence" I don't know what that means it's not really a sentence that I can extract information out of. I think you're trying to say that it failed because the idea perpetuates the elimination of criminal violence but I don't understand how you came to that conclusion. Please expound.

Also, you mention that I want to put restrictions on criminals and somehow contest that a "counterbalance" is the most important part of what I said. That's not true, I'd wager player interaction and reasons to do so is more important than "counterbalance". However, you seemed to miss some of my post. Improving the economy and the destruction of vehicles which you seem to disagree with actually help criminals TREMENDOUSLY. Why? Because they allow an avenue for harm beyond murder. A financial harm. You can destroy someone's car and blow their insurance premiums through the roof. Who'd they rather pay, the gangsters to keep them safe or the insurance company every time they respawn their car?

You also missed the part about drugs giving you armor. Unless there's some other method of attaining armor for criminals that I don't know about, taking a few hits of cocaine sounds like a nice way to even the score with the cops.

Finally, I implore you to introspect and examine your posts. We often discuss how we as a community want to move away from Cops vs Robbers but you seem stuck on the idea. You want balance between criminals and cops in every post, when that's not the reality. Cops are supposed to have an advantage on criminals, it's what makes playing a criminal fun. By choosing to be a criminal you forgo any "duties" or a "job" but in exchange you don't get a kevlar vest, taser, Police Cruiser and a Glock-17 with hollow-tips. Once again you think it's unbalanced but you're playing a different game than everyone else.

[thiggins19]

11 minutes ago, Alverin said:

You also missed the part about drugs giving you armor. Unless there's some other method of attaining armor for criminals that I don't know about, taking a few hits of cocaine sounds like a nice way to even the score with the cops.

Official factions can import armour.

[Alverin]

6 minutes ago, thiggins19 said:

Official factions can import armour.

I see, in my system the import method would be scrapped and armor would either be strictly through drugs or attained similarly to Weapons Crafting. Thanks for the clarification!