Department of Justice/Legal RP

[Olipro]

I've been mulling this over for quite a while and finally decided to get off my butt and put something together.

I believe that Legal RP could be very rewarding and I also happen to have a decent amount of knowledge with regard to the law and would be happy to kick this off with anyone else who could pitch in and bring it to fruitition.

So, firstly, here is what I consider the goals for the first-cut:

1. Create Legal RP and a DOJ.
2. Implement it in such a way that it does not immediately fail due to the sheer number of players on the server.
3. Emphasise Roleplay - court cases should be expected to potentially take longer than the jail time. those who are not interested in the RP may choose to go straight to prison.
4. Ensure the system is balanced. Jury trials might be feasible in future, but it would obviously require sourcing individuals with a high-standard of RP.
5. Acknowledge that the system will need to be tuned and aim to deliver a minimum viable system to ensure it is managable before throwing in more bells and whistles.
6. Consider implementing only civil cases or only criminal cases to allow time to get a feel for the system.
7. Provide sample papers that can be used, but nonetheless permit any legitimate pleadings.

See the following for suggested pleading papers - bearing in mind that there are of course more samples I would create such as subpoenas, motion to dismiss, motion for continuance, motion for summary judgement, ex-parte motions for relief, etc:

Example Bench Trial Demand

Example Bench Trial Demand Response

Department of Justice Handbook

Department of Justice Internal Structure Manual

State Bar Exam

State Bar License Terms

With that in mind, the first item to address is the criterion and mechanics of what I currently believe would be suitable for criminal trials:

1. A Bench trial for a criminal case requires that the charges be sufficiently serious, entail a reasonable amount of jail time and not have arisen through any server rule violations and/or that the individual requesting the trial is known and trusted to deliver a high-standard of RP.
2. The DOJ shall have final say on filing a request to the court to hold a bench trial and may choose to deny it for OOC misconduct if deemed relevant.
3. A defendant may have only one bench trial active at a time and:
   1. They shall receive automatic bail subject to a withholding bond payable in cash or assets (if cars, they are impounded. If houses, a lien is placed, but they do not need to lose access)
   2. Any further crimes they commit whilst on bail may be admitted into evidence. You will go straight to jail for those crimes.
4. A Government forum section would exist for the court docket. Pleading papers would be filed there and processed by a judge.
5. Trial dates will be arranged OOCly for all parties to be able to attend.
6. Lawyers must pass a bar examination. A Defendent may opt for pro-se representation (self-representation)
7. All cases are public. For any evidence to be "sealed" it must be motioned for, approved by a judge and held in a protected forum area. A party may motion for it to be unsealed.
8. Crimes for Perjury, Practicing Law without a license and Contempt of Court would be added. These charges may only be filed by or at the request of a judge.
9. Multiple defendants involved in the same scenario wishing to be tried in court shall all be tried together for the same charges under the same case regardless of whether they only committed a subset of the entire count of charges. This could change in future if there are sufficient DOJ players to process cases. If you don't like it, opt out of the trial and go straight to jail.
10. Real US case law may be presented for the purpose of setting precedent, as may prior in-game cases.
11. The structure of a criminal case would be as follows:
    1. The DOJ files a bench trial demand on the forum (see example pleading paper above)
    2. A Judge reviews stamps and signs the paper, sending a government forum PM to the defendant with the court summons and including the demand document from the DOJ.
    3. The defendant or their lawyer may file a response acknowledging the summons and motioning for discovery within a reasonable deadline.
    4. A judge will review the response (if any) and grant, deny or permit with modifications/conditions, the response.
    5. The prosecution must then provide any materials motioned for - almost certainly whatever they intend to admit into evidence.
    6. Depositions may be conducted by either side. Anyone refusing to be depositioned or surrender evidence may be subpoena'd, subject to a judge approving the subpoena.
    7. Witnesses must be subpoena'd to also appear unless the defence will depositional evidence. OOC cooperation is key here; attempting to hold up the trial because a witness can't be summoned should not be tolerated. Nonetheless, the right to confront your accusers should be adhered to as best as possible.
    8. A pro-se defendant may bring one person to assist them, but all communications with the court must be conducted by the defendant.
    9. The legal standard for conviction for each count is that of being beyond all reasonable doubt.
    10. The trial date occurs and is conducted thus:
        1. Everyone, excepting on-duty law enforcement must be unarmed in court. Any uninvolved LEO may act as bailiff.
        2. The judge calls the session to order, anyone who will be involved in the case(s) are sworn in and parties are instructed to communicate only with the presiding judge.
        3. The defendant is asked to enter their plea for each count; a plea of Guilty or Nolo Contendere for all charges shall terminate the case immediately and they shall be taken to serve them.
        4. Opening statements are made by the prosecution and defence. No interruptions.
        5. Evidence and witness testimony is referred to. Either side may announce objections and they shall be sustained or overruled. The defence must be permitted to cross-examine witnesses and question any evidence.
        6. Closing statements are made by the prosecution and defence. No interruptions.
        7. The judge retires to deliberate and returns to deliver their verdict on each individual count and the defendant is either imprisoned or released.
        8. Where possible, a transcript or video recording of the trial should be made and attached to the case file before it is closed.

Civil cases would follow a similar format, except:

1. Cases are more heavily paperwork based, all parties shall have full knowledge of the evidence/testimony the opposing side intends to present in court.
2. Filing a case is subject to a fee. the court shall have the power to declare an individual as a vexatious litigant and disallow them from filing civil cases for an appropriate period of time and optionally charge them with Contempt of Court.
3. Plaintiffs may apply for relief in the form of money or tangible goods. If assets are seized and sold, to cover a monetary amount, the plaintiff shall only receive the granted amount.
   1. Assets purchased through the credit store shall not ICly be considered.
   2. Deliberately transferring assets to avoid paying shall fall under Contempt of Court. Assisting parties shall also be liable for the same charge.
4. The case shall be considered based on a preponderance of the evidence. This is a lower level than beyond all reasonable doubt and standard for civil cases.

Lawyers:

1. Lawyers must pass a bar examination to become certified, their license shall be subject to the following:
   1. The character must have no felonies on their record. Subsequent felonies shall result in immediate disbarment.
   2. A Lawyer may not take on cases for vexatious litigants. (civil)
   3. A Lawyer found to be supporting vexatious litigation may be suspended from practicing law for an appropriate period of time or disbarred.
   4. A Lawyer must not advocate for any individual where it would present a conflict of interest. Doing so shall also be grounds for suspension or disbarment.
2. Law school classes will be held to educate people on legal matters and to prepare them for the Bar Exam. Once they have passed the bar, they are then able to practice.

Judges:

1. Must have passed the bar examination.
2. Must have passed an IC and OOC interview, demonstrating sufficient knowledge and commitment.
3. Must not preside over any case presenting a conflict of interest or bringing impartiality into question.
4. May not be corrupt. This could change later, but at least initially, this could introduce severe complications while tuning the system.
5. May also conduct business as a lawyer if it does not violate any of the above.
6. As in real life, a judge ay help the defence/prosecution with procedural advice, but may not hint at or direct either party to (not) motion for anything, no matter how obviously they are hurting their own case by doing so or not doing so and must only react to/consider representations and permitted evidence made by either party.

Development/Forum work required:

1. A Courtroom - preferably, but we could potentially wing it at another location, temporarily.
2. Addition of new charges to the Penal Code and MDC.
3. Ideally, a mechanism to pay court filing costs, but the government donation location could also work.
4. Creation of a DOJ faction.
5. Creation of a DOJ subforum on the gov. website for lawyer licenses, cases and sealed evidence.

Misc Possibilities:

1. Use of the Davis courthouse (pictured below) - equally, it could simply be an additional entrance at City Hall, for convenience.
2. DOC acting as bailiffs/Court Security.
3. DoJ logo (also pictured below)

Thanks if you've been reading this far. This is obviously a first draft so let me know what you think and I'm hopeful this could become a thing!

Edited June 25, 2020 by Olipro
Added State Bar Exam, License Terms & DOJ Handbooks

[Denza]

Please yes. This has been suggested multiple times, it's obvious that the community really wants this. There are many people that are more than willing to work on this.

[IAmTurtle]

i would say yes to it being added. but people dont want to rp it.

-1

[Olipro]

10 hours ago, IAmTurtle said:

i would say yes to it being added. but people dont want to rp it.

-1

This wouldn't interfere with current mechanics. If you don't want the RP, go straight to jail like you do now.

However, there are people who do want the RP, why should that be denied when it's no skin off anyone else's nose?

Edited May 22, 2020 by Olipro

[Luxas]

+1 always happy to see new stuff for civs added to the server!

Would bring it so many more jobs, Court Staff, Security, Extra Police, Police Convoys (Prison Transport to and from court house), would also bring in prison breaks for crims (attacking the convoys, attacking the courthouse etc)

 

[IAmTurtle]

7 hours ago, Olipro said:

This wouldn't interfere with current mechanics. If you don't want the RP, go straight to jail like you do now.

However, there are people who do want the RP, why should that be denied when it's no skin off anyone else's nose?

this has been made a thread many times and has been discussed quite a bit on discord. there is a far greater majority does not want it. people just want to get over there sentence as fast as possible. so this would just slow it down. 

[Olipro]

17 hours ago, IAmTurtle said:

this has been made a thread many times and has been discussed quite a bit on discord. there is a far greater majority does not want it. people just want to get over there sentence as fast as possible. so this would just slow it down. 

Not sure how I could put it any clearer: Under my proposal, you, as the criminal, have to choose the RP. It is an opt-in. If you don't want to do it, you don't have to.

[Z0thian]

+1 very thorough and well thought out take on this!

[Felcon]

+1 with DOJ maybe even do stuff where people who get an X amount of charges or who have the money to get a lawyer before they get put in prison. This would also help with the ridiculous just IA report attitude from officers instead of trying to engage in for example bodycam RP  

[Dim]

+1

[Arnis]

+1

 

[Mr_Lightnin]

I'm literally trying to go down this route, please yes yes yes. +1. It would make RP so much more immersive, and give people like me something to grab onto! It'd be an interesting link with the Police too, lawyer working with/against. It means someone would be able to sue another player as well. +1

[cesare]

+1

[Vubey]

If they added this it would be very epic. Imagaine all the new RP opportunities. 1+

[Clazza]

+1 100%. i feel like some of the cops give far too harsh sentances for the crimes commited

[Olipro]

On 5/25/2020 at 11:10 AM, Clazza said:

+1 100%. i feel like some of the cops give far too harsh sentances for the crimes commited

In terms of the roleplay, you will end up spending more time fighting it than you would choosing to simply serve it; of course, if you're found innocent, it could net you some compensation.

[JackaboyGames]

+1

[Tony_Mountain]

As a IRL lawyer from a Civil Law Country, I would suggest a simpler format where cases can be decided on the "paper" literally by forum posts with due dates. After parties expose their take, the Judge could call for a hearing to solve the issue. I think this would a less complicated system than the common law system. Also, it opens the chance to RP law schools. I'm more than willing to help build a DoJ that can work on a mixed law system designed for Los Santos. 

[Olipro]

So, I've been doing some more work on this; the original post has been updated with a sample of what I think would be a viable State Bar exam. I have also included a mention of Law School classes being held to educate people to prepare them for the examination.

https://forms.gle/r6rMaV5q8SXn7wiW8

Or you can just click that link.

[Kent_Bardoue]

I support this, this would provide soo much more RP to people who don't want to do illegal shit 24/7. It'll be fun to RP it

[Victor Einhart]

With the new parole division in SD, I could see this actually being feasible as someone with charges could live in the parole system while their trial is pending.

[Percival]

On 5/22/2020 at 8:34 AM, Olipro said:

This wouldn't interfere with current mechanics. If you don't want the RP, go straight to jail like you do now.

However, there are people who do want the RP, why should that be denied when it's no skin off anyone else's nose?

 

+1 There are those who wish not to RP and go straight to prison. There are also those who wish to fight it out and would LOVE for a chance to argue for their innocence. The sheer amount of potential role-play can LITERALLY bring this server onto ITS NEXT LEVEL. 

If there are a group of players interested in developing this system more, it'd be a great pleasure for me to contribute some ideas and proposals to.

I can roleplay in a court trial all day and not get bored of it. Those who love to debate constantly will LOVE this type of roleplay. A legal system will not be doomed to fail, and will only attract more people to join the community.

[Vincent Bonelli]

What I've seen be successful in other communities is to allow lawyers to negotiate charges at holding, and then also be there to decide whether or not a client wants to go to court.

 

I think do to the sheer number of criminal charges on the server, that only top felonies would even be considered for court cases. District Attorney/Judge would review case files and decide which cases are legitimate enough to go to court. THEN, joint court dates would be set where there would be many cases heard. Some may be pushed to next date, etc.

[Olipro]

3 minutes ago, Vincent Bonelli said:

What I've seen be successful in other communities is to allow lawyers to negotiate charges at holding, and then also be there to decide whether or not a client wants to go to court.

 

I think do to the sheer number of criminal charges on the server, that only top felonies would even be considered for court cases. District Attorney/Judge would review case files and decide which cases are legitimate enough to go to court. THEN, joint court dates would be set where there would be many cases heard. Some may be pushed to next date, etc.

Ultimately, the goal would be to have an economy of privately operating attorneys and public defenders. As in my initial post, the gov. forum would be used for the court docket and scheduling; cases would only be "joint" for scenarios where multiple individuals participated in the same crime and there are simply too many to handle their cases individually.

A trial would be called for primarily on the basis of legitimacy; if the defense has a legitimate claim against their charges then DOJ can accept it. Ideally that would consist of delegated responsibility via a DA and ADA but it's all going to depend on initial numbers of people who can be trained up. I use the term "DOJ" generically, since whoever would ultimately accept a case is going to come down to numbers and competency of faction members, at least initially.

Realistically, in terms of getting this off the ground, I'd like to have people under the DOJ faction be required to "float" between prosecution and public defender on an as-needed basis, just to ensure we can actually get trials going - once there are sufficient numbers, we could look to start assigning people to more dedicated roles.

Defendants would of course typically have the right to handle their case in pro per - however, in the event of sealed evidence (e.g. witnesses whom the defendant would likely try to have killed if they discovered their names), then the prosecution would motion the court to appoint an attorney for the defense so that the sealed information is not given directly to the accused.

[PingasOner]

+1