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Yputi

Current car theft, chop and mors system

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Hello.

I would like to bring up certain topics to suggest a game change, but  I would like to find out what everyone's thoughts are on the current system/changes we had not too long ago aswell.

1. Chop shops
The most impactfull change I think is how chop shop's changed. It used to be 1 location active at the time and a chop time of 8 minutes, which now changed (I can't share too much, because of MG). It changed in such way that I feel like you can't leave your vehicle for 2 minutes and someone will try and steal it. Thats because the value is mostly high, risk is mostly low too and there is barely time for someone to do something against it. By the time it's reported stolen it is already chopped up in pieces. PD/SD barely has time to set anything up.
Instead of hiding stolen cars and stuff like they would do IRL, in ECRP it's just chopping it as fast as possible.

The system itself is very cool. I like the system itself better than the old one, but I feel like realism of amount of vehicles getting stolen is a bit hard to find. However, this, in my opinion, doesn't mean the chop shop should maybe be adjusted, but I feel l ike something else should be adjusted, which will lead to the next point:


2. Vehicle theft.

Vehicles can get stolen quite easily. All you need to do is have the car unlocked and you done. 

In my eyes, this is where the biggest issue is. Even a simple Google search got me to this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAQRMGZtMjM
It makes no sense, realism wise, that cars can be stolen simply by breaking into it. All what keys do in ECRP is make you able to unlock the car and lock it. To start the engine, you don't need anything. The only vehicle that requires a key to start are police cruisers, but I fail to see why only the police cruisers would have this and not any other vehicle. Same with the alarm going off after your attempt. If someone screws up, it's not after they are done.

An addition to this is the lack of secutiry upgrades (atleast, in my opinion). I personally know someone IRL that owns an Audi RS6. The RS6 is a car that is quite common for getting stolen. The owner of it upgraded the security system at a garage as the original one didn't felt secure enough. 
What this did with the car is:
- Call from Emergency center if vehicle is being moved while locked
- Permanent tracking applied in multiple spots in the vehicle
- Steeringwheel lock

But in general (having Audi as example) these are common additions you can buy.
7beda4cb8e2e2c6d78cee3ac5deaa715.png

I believe, mainly because of this, car theft is just extremely high when compared to IRL. And I do have to say I got used to it, but I still believe it's not realistic. 

Combined with the chop shop update, you kinda get the same situation before the "public robbery update". The update of public robberies was made so people can just interact without the fear getting robbed at unrealistic places. Now I feel like (mostly legal) people always need their car in sight or else it gets stolen, since it's so easy and not hard at all. This is where the situation of excessive illegal parking comes from. I do believe some might see this as an IC issue, but same could have been said about the public robbery update. It just annoys mostly legal people as even having their game crash will make them fear for getting their car stolen. Especially with people being able to check the vehicles locked/unlocked state by trying to interact with doors while not showing anyone they check if the vehicle is locked or not.


3. Mors insurance recover time compared to chop time.

Here I am also curious what people's opinions are. I don't have much to add to this.




TL;DR
The risk to value ratio of car theft is so good that people have to be cautious 24/7 and stay near their cars to prevent it from getting stolen. Even having a game crash will make me nervous of getting a car lock picked and chopped. No system prevents high value cars from being stolen other than the lock every vehicle has. This gives the same effect the "public robbery" rule was made for, to create a more realistic enviroment for people to RP in, in my eyes atleast.


Possible solutions could be:
- Introduction of hotwiring.
- Introduction of an ignition system in general (Where people could leave keys in their vehicle).
- Introduction of upgradable anti-theft systems at mechanic shops.
- Mors Insurance "subscription" tiers. For example: low-tier coverage, mid tier and high tier. This would also affect recovery time.
- Give car alarms a change to go off while lockpicking, not just after, but still having the chance of succeeding eventhough the alarm goes off.

I just wanna make sure people who actually do not take good care of their car will get an upgrade out of this. I just feel like people who just handle their vehicles like average people would do IRL won't get affected this much by the current way of how car theft works, as if the way how it works right now would be applied IRL, that would mean even going to a supermarket will have your car getting stolen.

I don't want this to come over as a complaint. Even if you find this system currently perfect I would not be upset. I mainly wanna figure out what other's woould think about such solutions and/or what they would prefer.

Edited by Yputi
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+1, This was something I thought about eventually making a post about myself. I have no issue with the chop shop system myself but I do think there needs to be some proactive system instead of a purely RNG based reactive system like the one we have currently in terms of vehicle pick-locking. People should have the option to fully RP taking care of their vehicles and have a script to support that, making it harder for criminals to steal those vehicles and go through more scripted steps. It can be balanced for criminals by making it easier to steal cars that aren't taken care of to the point where sometimes locks don't even engage correctly on certain vehicle models. I'm sure there's even more ways to balance this and I'd also be interested in other opinions on it.

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+1 while i have not suffered from this (so far), the chopping vehicles is too available and is too fast, most of the time people dont even have time to react to their car getting chopped and they are stuck waiting 4h at mors.

Would be interesting to have a double break in system, 1 time to get in the vehicle, 1 time to turn the engine on. Additionally, if you stalled, you would have to hot-wire it again.

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+1 while i have not suffered from this (so far), the chopping vehicles is too available and is too fast, most of the time people dont even have time to react to their car getting chopped and they are stuck waiting 4h at mors.

Would be interesting to have a double break in system, 1 time to get in the vehicle, 1 time to turn the engine on. Additionally, if you stalled, you would have to hot-wire it again.

Agreed. 

Don't get me wrong, chop shop is decent how it works now, but not in combination with the lack of security on vehicles now. Even before chop shops got the update I felt like car security could be better, but now it's worse due to the insanely increased availability and reduced time.

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+1, I think the new chop time is fine, because it made people go AFK for 8 minutes a lot, which would ruin many RP scenarios. But changing it to be 1 or 2 chopshops that only are in use at once is something that I don't think would be bad idea, however it raises a flaw in the current turf system, with some gangs gaining more power if their chop was randomly chosen, if reverted, I think this should be a key factor in the change. 

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I don't mind so many chop shops, I mind the very unrealistic car thefts that go on. You can't really go anywhere and leave your car there for longer than 2 mintues and it'll be gone. I'd rather see some security upgrades for mechanics to install

lvl 0 = bobby pin

lvl 1 = bobby pin and pliers

lvl 2 = bobby pin, pliers and computer

lvl 3 = bobby pin, pliers, computer and special decoder that official crim factions could get

Edited by Marca
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I don't mind so many chop shops, I mind the very unrealistic car thefts that go on. You can't really go anywhere and leave your car there for longer than 2 mintues and it'll be gone. I'd rather see some security upgrades for mechanics to install

lvl 0 = bobby pin

lvl 1 = bobby pin and pliers

lvl 2 = bobby pin, pliers and computer

lvl 3 = bobby pin, pliers, computer and special decoder that official crim factions could get

Yea I agree. Some peopel point at the chop shops being OP, but I feel like the source of the problem is vehicle security. Of course the chop shops got improved, but due to the lack of vehicle security this improvement is very big.

Edited by Yputi
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+1, I think the new chop time is fine, because it made people go AFK for 8 minutes a lot, which would ruin many RP scenarios. But changing it to be 1 or 2 chopshops that only are in use at once is something that I don't think would be bad idea, however it raises a flaw in the current turf system, with some gangs gaining more power if their chop was randomly chosen, if reverted, I think this should be a key factor in the change. 

I agree 8 min was kinda... boring, but limiting the amount of chop shops dont make a lot of sense either in my opinion. Atleast I would say inplement something that requires you to keep doing something, but I still believe the biggest issue is with the car security and if that gets improved, I feel like most of this problem would get resolved.

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+1.

 

Chopping wasn't perfect before, but it definitely feels far too prevalent now, as it seems like vehicle theft is almost the best way to make money. I wouldn't mind that if there was more skill or difficulty to chopping, but in the current state, its almost too easy. I'm a big fan of the key system, which could be easily linked to the engine off and on buttons. This would require thieves to either steal the key too, or to hotwire the car, which could be a nice little skill-check minigame to keep criminals on their toes.

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+1

 

lvl 0 = bobby pin

lvl 1 = bobby pin and pliers

lvl 2 = bobby pin, pliers and computer

lvl 3 = bobby pin, pliers, computer and special decoder that official crim factions could get

Vehicles definitly need 'upgrades' and teirs to security systems done by Mechanics at possibly a new garage opened specifiacally for lock upgrades. Slightly off topic but maybe 'physical' keys that are linked to your vehicles (could show up in /vehiclestats ie. [Vehicle] [Plate] [Keys:1] as I know actual physical keys would be a ballache) so when you buy a car your given a single key. But if you want to give a spare key to a friend or 2 you could go to the new garage and get a new key cut/coded - depending on the level of security which could cost more depending - which would increase the number of keys you 'have' and when you give someone a key that number changes respectivly.

lvl 0 - 'Stock Lock and Barrel' - No cost - Additional Key $1000 = Opened with bobby pin - Alerts Owner if failed lockpick

lvl 1 - 'Lock and Barrel, Fob' - $1500 - Additional Key $1750 = Opened with bobby pin but takes 1.5/2 times longer - Alerts Owner if failed

lvl 2 - 'Fob, Key Proximity Sensor' -$3000 - Additional Key $2500 = Opened with bobby pin and computer - Alerts Owner if failed or succeeded

lvl 3 - 'Top Teir Security System' - $5000 - Additional Key $3500 = Opened with bobby pin, computer and special decoder that official crim factions could get - Alerts Owner if failed or succeeded, also has a chance to alert owner as soon as the attempt has started

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+1

Vehicles definitly need 'upgrades' and teirs to security systems done by Mechanics at possibly a new garage opened specifiacally for lock upgrades. Slightly off topic but maybe 'physical' keys that are linked to your vehicles (could show up in /vehiclestats ie. [Vehicle] [Plate] [Keys:1] as I know actual physical keys would be a ballache) so when you buy a car your given a single key. But if you want to give a spare key to a friend or 2 you could go to the new garage and get a new key cut/coded - depending on the level of security which could cost more depending - which would increase the number of keys you 'have' and when you give someone a key that number changes respectivly.

lvl 0 - 'Stock Lock and Barrel' - No cost - Additional Key $1000 = Opened with bobby pin - Alerts Owner if failed lockpick

lvl 1 - 'Lock and Barrel, Fob' - $1500 - Additional Key $1750 = Opened with bobby pin but takes 1.5/2 times longer - Alerts Owner if failed

lvl 2 - 'Fob, Key Proximity Sensor' -$3000 - Additional Key $2500 = Opened with bobby pin and computer - Alerts Owner if failed or succeeded

lvl 3 - 'Top Teir Security System' - $5000 - Additional Key $3500 = Opened with bobby pin, computer and special decoder that official crim factions could get - Alerts Owner if failed or succeeded, also has a chance to alert owner as soon as the attempt has started

I think this would be cool, but I have some issues with it. What happens if you get robbed/killed? How would you get your key back? Also, I think that you would need to raise the price of these tiers because for only 5k it would be almost impossible for your car to be picked unless in an official faction. Also, I would word it a bit different unless you meant to say this, instead of "Opened with bobby pin, computer and special decoder that only official criminal factions get", I would say "Only openable by special decoder that official criminal factions get."

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+1

Vehicles definitly need 'upgrades' and teirs to security systems done by Mechanics at possibly a new garage opened specifiacally for lock upgrades. Slightly off topic but maybe 'physical' keys that are linked to your vehicles (could show up in /vehiclestats ie. [Vehicle] [Plate] [Keys:1] as I know actual physical keys would be a ballache) so when you buy a car your given a single key. But if you want to give a spare key to a friend or 2 you could go to the new garage and get a new key cut/coded - depending on the level of security which could cost more depending - which would increase the number of keys you 'have' and when you give someone a key that number changes respectivly.

lvl 0 - 'Stock Lock and Barrel' - No cost - Additional Key $1000 = Opened with bobby pin - Alerts Owner if failed lockpick

lvl 1 - 'Lock and Barrel, Fob' - $1500 - Additional Key $1750 = Opened with bobby pin but takes 1.5/2 times longer - Alerts Owner if failed

lvl 2 - 'Fob, Key Proximity Sensor' -$3000 - Additional Key $2500 = Opened with bobby pin and computer - Alerts Owner if failed or succeeded

lvl 3 - 'Top Teir Security System' - $5000 - Additional Key $3500 = Opened with bobby pin, computer and special decoder that official crim factions could get - Alerts Owner if failed or succeeded, also has a chance to alert owner as soon as the attempt has started

 

 

I think this would be cool, but I have some issues with it. What happens if you get robbed/killed? How would you get your key back? Also, I think that you would need to raise the price of these tiers because for only 5k it would be almost impossible for your car to be picked unless in an official faction. Also, I would word it a bit different unless you meant to say this, instead of "Opened with bobby pin, computer and special decoder that only official criminal factions get", I would say "Only openable by special decoder that official criminal factions get."

Agreed. Prices of security upgrades should be A LOT higher. Something with keys should be figured out too yea, but I like the idea.

I would indeed love some different ways to steal a car. Especially with all things you see online too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJ6dct9e_Z4


There just has to be a different system than current system that changes the risk vs reward imo and also imrpove variety and fun factor. Not just pure money imo.

Great suggestions, definitely something potentially usefull to work from

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I think this would be cool, but I have some issues with it. What happens if you get robbed/killed? How would you get your key back? Also, I think that you would need to raise the price of these tiers because for only 5k it would be almost impossible for your car to be picked unless in an official faction. Also, I would word it a bit different unless you meant to say this, instead of "Opened with bobby pin, computer and special decoder that only official criminal factions get", I would say "Only openable by special decoder that official criminal factions get."

Yeah I agree on prices being higher, was just a quick example of how price scaling could work. If it was ever intergrated I would expect the staff to do some balancing on prices as I'm not familiar with the economy all too much. The 'physical' keys wouldnt be an item in your inv per say that could be taken. Just you would have to pay to increase the amount you own and therefore give out if you get me? If you dont have a spare when you do the command to give a key temp or perm it could just respond saying you dont have a spare key so you'd get another one cut and then in /vehiclestats it could say you now have 2 buts its not an actual item. And yeah wording was taken straight from Marca's suggestion to further build on the idea. But yeah, you probably wouldnt need a computer and a decoder, but maybe still need to pick the doors lock and then sit inside to use decoder/computer? Added risk for higher end cars possibly.
 

 

 

Agreed. Prices of security upgrades should be A LOT higher. Something with keys should be figured out too yea, but I like the idea.

Yeah 100% higher prices. Was just an example for how they could potentially scale prices alongside higher teir locks having more expensive 'keys'.

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+1 Overall

For quite some time I have wanted to see car thefts become something a bit more engaging and all around difficult to be honest. I find it fairly unrealistic that just a simple bobby pin is all that is needed to get in and start a vehicle. There simply needs to be more to it which I think hotwiring can assist with. Along with this, upgradable security is a nice thing to consider as well although I would rather this not require assistance from official factions (decoder). In addition I would like to suggest perhaps having to maintain said security for your vehicle as opposed to a one time modification payment which would not only provide a money sink but also promote continuous/regular traffic for mechanic shops and push people to further value their vehicles. Finally, I would highly advocate for some type of repair kit. There are a lot of vehicles that get abandoned when they stall/run out of gas and time/resources get wasted trying to snag these only to find out they cannot move. Repair kits shouldn't allow the vehicle to move very far or for very long so it would still require thought on when it is beneficial to use them on an abandoned vehicle.

Just some rambling food for thought here after thinking about this for a long time. Very good suggestion OP!

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+1 Overall

For quite some time I have wanted to see car thefts become something a bit more engaging and all around difficult to be honest. I find it fairly unrealistic that just a simple bobby pin is all that is needed to get in and start a vehicle. There simply needs to be more to it which I think hotwiring can assist with. Along with this, upgradable security is a nice thing to consider as well although I would rather this not require assistance from official factions (decoder). In addition I would like to suggest perhaps having to maintain said security for your vehicle as opposed to a one time modification payment which would not only provide a money sink but also promote continuous/regular traffic for mechanic shops and push people to further value their vehicles. Finally, I would highly advocate for some type of repair kit. There are a lot of vehicles that get abandoned when they stall/run out of gas and time/resources get wasted trying to snag these only to find out they cannot move. Repair kits shouldn't allow the vehicle to move very far or for very long so it would still require thought on when it is beneficial to use them on an abandoned vehicle.

Just some rambling food for thought here after thinking about this for a long time. Very good suggestion OP!

+1 For regular maintenance and repair kits, the issue with repair kits originally was that traffic for mechanic shops and tow calls would be drastically reduced however if people needed regular maintenance for car locks and engines this would balance it out. So less tow calls but more maintenance and works at the shops themselves. Combine both for a much more involved system when it comes to looking after your cars and for crims to be able to much easier steal cars that aren't well maintained but assess risk/reward more when thinking about taking one

Edit: Perhaps slightly increased chop prices especially for higher value cars so that the decreased volume of cars to steal is balanced and doesn't completely nerf crim income avenues

Edited by Maccy
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+1 Overall

For quite some time I have wanted to see car thefts become something a bit more engaging and all around difficult to be honest. I find it fairly unrealistic that just a simple bobby pin is all that is needed to get in and start a vehicle. There simply needs to be more to it which I think hotwiring can assist with. Along with this, upgradable security is a nice thing to consider as well although I would rather this not require assistance from official factions (decoder). In addition I would like to suggest perhaps having to maintain said security for your vehicle as opposed to a one time modification payment which would not only provide a money sink but also promote continuous/regular traffic for mechanic shops and push people to further value their vehicles. Finally, I would highly advocate for some type of repair kit. There are a lot of vehicles that get abandoned when they stall/run out of gas and time/resources get wasted trying to snag these only to find out they cannot move. Repair kits shouldn't allow the vehicle to move very far or for very long so it would still require thought on when it is beneficial to use them on an abandoned vehicle.

Just some rambling food for thought here after thinking about this for a long time. Very good suggestion OP!

agreed.

About the one-time install of security especially. Pesonally I think what would make most sense if people would have to re-install certain security upgrades if someone attempted to break into it maybe. Or when a vehicle is chopped. 
- If lockpicked, the lock could possibly be broken if done in a certain way.
- Certain optional alarm systems (Like some idea's that were mentioned before) would have to be reinstalled when recovered from mors (This would also stimulate people to not trash their car and get it stuck, in the water or anything).

I actually also think about possible suggestions regarding the GPS tracker. I understand the cooldown as it would be quite OP, but I believe it makes no sense for a tracker not working when someone is in it. Thats just simply not how trackers work. What I personally would prefer is a system where the tracker gets upgraded, but also can be disabled/removed in a certain way by a person when stealing a car. This would take more time and risk ofcourse, but IRL car thieves also take stolen cars to certain locations and strip it to locate trackers. 
This maybe also as an upgrade? Where you have a standard tracker that has the same/similair perks as current one and an upgraded option where you can always track it, but it can be removed.

In general I think I find these the most important suggestions:
- Hotwiring when not having keys
- Possibility of alarm going off during and/or after lockpick attempt
- Being able to upgrade security (even if it's just one that will affect the success rate or one that adds features, I would love anything more than this current system)
- Security upgrades (partly) having to be applied when car gets taken out of mors.

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+1 to the whole idea and I would like to add one change to the Chop Shop if I could that would be...

> Pull up the chop shop with the vehicle 
> Talk to the NPC there at the time they'll then direct you to start removing certain parts of the vehicle 
> Starting with the windows, doors, wheels, lights 
> Moving onto the engine block and other misc parts of the vehicle 
> Once its chopped you talk to NPC to collect your money.

Total chopping time being dependant if you have you have a hammer/crowbar/drill etc so with all the tools to strip a vehicle quickly it could be 5-7 minutes with one or two tools 8-10 minutes and with no tools 12 minutes. 

This would not only add some good realism to the idea of chopping a vehicle but would also re-add to the police charge "Operating a Chop Shop" currently you are never fully operating the chop shop because you can start the chop walk 15-25 feet away be in a vehicle be on top of a roof while the vehicle is just magically decaying.

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+1 to the whole idea and I would like to add one change to the Chop Shop if I could that would be...

> Pull up the chop shop with the vehicle 
> Talk to the NPC there at the time they'll then direct you to start removing certain parts of the vehicle 
> Starting with the windows, doors, wheels, lights 
> Moving onto the engine block and other misc parts of the vehicle 
> Once its chopped you talk to NPC to collect your money.

Total chopping time being dependant if you have you have a hammer/crowbar/drill etc so with all the tools to strip a vehicle quickly it could be 5-7 minutes with one or two tools 8-10 minutes and with no tools 12 minutes. 

This would not only add some good realism to the idea of chopping a vehicle but would also re-add to the police charge "Operating a Chop Shop" currently you are never fully operating the chop shop because you can start the chop walk 15-25 feet away be in a vehicle be on top of a roof while the vehicle is just magically decaying.

yeah i know that a different server came out with a system like this and I think it would be a great addition

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