Charlotte Valmont Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 (edited) The use of haircutting is an issue I have wanted to address on ECRP for some time. I have reflected on this a great deal as I want to avoid making game-wide suggestions that are influenced solely on my own personal values. However, after having a number of discussions with other female ECRP players from many walks of life I feel this is a seriously important recommendation to put forward to the larger community. I would really like to see the command for haircutting entirely removed from ECRP (or altered in a significant way). In my experience it is never used following appropriate IC RP escalation and has become the go-to method for male (and some female) players to shame, embarrass, and harass female (identifying) players. Not only is it degrading ICly it then requires the victim to travel to a salon and pay for new hair again (which isn't very RP to begin with). Most of the time, if not always, these players have been robbed and thus have no means of transportation and potentially no money. And while we'd like to think ECRP is just a game and the things that happen in-game shouldn't matter to us personally, its ignorant not to consider the context that haircutting has for some people. Just like the use of rape or torture, haircutting is often deeply tied to religious, cultural, and historical frameworks that have significance to lots of people for many reasons - most of whom are women, and most of which are regarding shame and purity. Here are a few suggestions: 1. treat haircutting like ERP and require consent from all parties (requiring a consensual script activation similar to /frisk) 2. remove the command all-together and require haircutting to be only-RP 3. have a special item (e.g., scissors) that can cut hair that can only be purchased in a salon for a significant amount of money (this could prevent a lot of frivolous non-RP haircutting) 4. remove haircutting all together I really, really hope that this suggestion is well received and is considered by ECRP decision makers. I welcome all input - please be kind! Edited January 13, 2021 by Charlotte Valmont 1 3 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtins Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 why? its not that deep hair is like 500$- 1000$ max lol just take the L if you get caught lacking 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalvinKlein Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 Dont get caught lacking and report ppl who cut your hair with no rp reason 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freshprinceIE Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 -1 It's not some sexist plot men use to shame women in game. It's usually done by men on other men. It's a part of almost every criminals story. You seem to think it's ok to go into a drug lab frequented by serial robbers and murderers, unarmed nonetheless, and think that all you will lose is 3 weed plants. You seem to think that it's NRP to shave someone's head after robbing them, but having absolutely no value for your life in a drug lab isn't? Personally, my character was robbed and had his hair cut. I was bald for a long time and it became part of my characters personality, I played him differently when bald. Haven't been robbed and had my haircut in months, I learned my lesson. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felcon Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 tbh cutting hair is an IC issue but if you nonrp cut hair for example cutting a cops hair or people cutting someones hair in public with no reason it could fall under nonrp but I dont think the command should be removed 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illmohim Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 -1 Why would this affect women more than men? I honestly don't see why this would be a problem regarding genders. I see men cutting other mens hair way more often than men cutting females hair. But this is not the point, I don't see why it would be non-rp or non realistic to cut someones hair to be honest, it's rather an IC issue. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swittzy Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 -1 I don't agree with the post. If someone abuses the command without proper RP report them. Besides that it seems like an IC issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloah Posted January 13, 2021 Report Share Posted January 13, 2021 -1 first off all its an ic issue and second off all if you are really harassed by losing your haircut you should behave icly and comply with the robbers i never lost my hair in situations such unless there was a hate between me and the other side BUT ... 1+ To this 12 hours ago, Charlotte Valmont said: 3. have a special item (e.g., scissors) that can cut hair that can only be purchased in a salon for a significant amount of money (this could prevent a lot of frivolous non-RP haircutting) It shouldn't be that expensive but it would be fun to actually be able to buy from barber shops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitney Posted January 15, 2021 Report Share Posted January 15, 2021 (edited) +1 Edited January 15, 2021 by Asterisk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Zhao Posted January 15, 2021 Report Share Posted January 15, 2021 (edited) +1 Not removed but changed slightly also for asking consent Edited January 15, 2021 by Jason Rhee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloah Posted January 15, 2021 Report Share Posted January 15, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, Asterisk said: While I do agree to this because I've been in the same situation, but if you've begged someone ICly not to cut your hair and informed them of the OOC consequences that it's not okay to do so for poor reasons thus trading your character's hair for a while to report someone and reflect that shame and embarrassment on them seems fair enough because it would only be that they are trying to force things to go their way. It's more like being in a van handpicking someone in real life who had not said a thing to you to rob them and cut their hair which seems really unrealistic to me because cutting hair is too personal and that's why it's wrong. You need to have a really good reason to do such punishment to someone. However, I think that there should indeed be consent permissions to this even if there's was good rp reasoning for such thing, UNLESS if it's bad it would depend on that person who is getting their hair cut if they want it to happen or not. How? You've provoked a criminal by reporting them to cops. That criminal escaped and came for you to rob you but also decided to cut your hair where in that case, it would be fine to cut their hair without consent. For someone who hasn't done anything wrong and was caught by a criminal and robbed which later escalated to hair-cutting, consent should be required because there would be no reason to get too personal other than robbing, that person being robbed would be choiced to agree or deny, based on what they want and if they would want to rp being bald for a while or not since there wasn't any good rp reason. OOC Communication for consent is always nice in severe cases and it should be ruled here differently as I personally don't see any issue with cutting someone's hair for a poor reason (but this would require consent). If someone is harassing you OOCly for that, it's reportable. If they are provoking you ICly, I think that it should be ruled here too because it doesn't seem realistic to be provoked randomly and it seems like poor rp. I don't think that randomly provoking someone is okay at all and the most reasonable part is that nobody ever harass or talk about someone who has cancer and is going through chemotherapy and it's just a reason because that doesn't really happen at all and people should also ask OOCly if they could harass that person's character or not over dumb circumstances that the person had no way to prevent from happening. I think that OOC consent should apply to this because some people just tend to intentionally tease other players by baiting them into getting angry hence building up heat between a player another. Randomly provoking someone ICly to bully them is bad and people should ask for consent from that player if they want to do so as in real life nobody really stands up in front of someone randomly to harass them and it should certainly be classified as harassment if that person doesn't stop (OOCly throwing silly comments and mocking someone's character). And +1 to the special scissors item part because cutting with a knife is totally dangerous and would in most cases hurt someone's scalp because they are not professional and it's a lot more risky than that item. Nobody would cut someone's hair with 'a knife' unless they want to torture them and I don't think that it seems realistic to be cutting hair with a knife unless the knife is scriptly used as an 'Oh no so scary' item. So this material should rather be better itemized by adding scissors. I'm not saying that it should be removed because I don't really support it getting fully removed but there could be a better way to deal with such situations before and after with proper communication and consent. Wigs should also be sold at stores with the ability to try them out in such cases and players shouldn't be allowed to use the barber for a while because that's not possible. Either remove it completely and make it as it is suggested here or classify it under the consent list as it can offend people in some cases, people should also know that such thing could happen to them if they provoke criminals. It's better to be supported with a rule than nothing. I don't agree with you at all . people are not psychos just to cut your hair for no reason , unless you have done something or said something . and i don't still get how could you be oocly harassed by losing your haircut in a game and making a rule which you need other parties consent to do rp is not healthy , because 99% of the people say no if they don't like what you are doing to their character . i personally did that to so many people but i usually try to stay out of it , but it doesn't make sense when you are on your knees and being robbed yet, you talk shit to your robber and try to trigger him , you can be sure that he is going to give you a haircut if you keep going just to show you your place at the moment your rp should make sense with your conditions in game, if your rp is not like a person who is being robbed and you shittalk people on your knees with no gun with a heavy gun pointed at you , you shouldn't be complaining about dying or losing haircut Edited January 15, 2021 by Eloah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Zhao Posted January 15, 2021 Report Share Posted January 15, 2021 1 minute ago, Eloah said: I don't agree with you at all . people are not psychos just to cut your hair for no reason , unless you have done something or said something . and i don't still get how could you be oocly harassed by losing your haircut in a game and making a rule which you need other parties consent to do rp is not healthy , because 99% of the people say no if they don't like what you are doing to their character . i personally did that to so many people but i usually try to stay out of it , but it doesn't make sense when you are on your knees and being robbed yet, you talk shit to your robber and try to trigger him , you can be sure that he is going to give you a haircut if you keep going just to show you your place at the moment I disagree. Because YOU may think it isn't that bad but it is trust me from experience that it happened to me IF not it's own rule then apart of ERP with asking consent because I think people shouldn't cut people's hair off without consent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloah Posted January 15, 2021 Report Share Posted January 15, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Jason Rhee said: I disagree. Because YOU may think it isn't that bad but it is trust me from experience that it happened to me IF not it's own rule then apart of ERP with asking consent because I think people shouldn't cut people's hair off without consent I have been playing on this server for a long time , i have kidnapped people , i have robbed people , and on the other side , i was kidnapped many times and i was robbed so many times and how many times do you think i lost my haircut ? and i don't remember a single time losing it because the robber just wanted to have some fun , i lost it only because i talked shit or there was a hate between us before the robbery happens . and the reason erp needs consent is because of the amount of teenagers playing on this server and they may find it disturbing because it's not healthy at all for them which i agree with this rule but you can't say cutting peoples hair should be considered erp because it's really not. and another reason is some people are not here to do such things and they want to enjoy the game the way they want which makes sense . another thing that needs consent in ecrp is kidnapping , kidnapping is actually allowed if you have DM rights towards the person you are willing to kidnap , but if you want to kidnap a person just to create some rp, you'll have to ask for consent so the person can decide if they even have time for such rp or no because situations like this are probably taking longer than 2 hours. cutting peoples hair doesn't have these factors . 1. it's not considered erp and if you find it disturbing then it's your problem 2.it doesn't require much time and it literally takes 30 seconds no ooc consent needed for cutting peoples hair Edited January 15, 2021 by Eloah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nexuus Posted January 15, 2021 Report Share Posted January 15, 2021 -1 I agree that cutting somebody's hair publicly and with no reason is quite unrealistic. However, if you are going to sit in a drug lab and expect no repercussions and complain if your hair gets cut, then simply don't go back or learn to avoid situations or locations that may lead to hostility. I have had my haircut once in my 2000 hours playing and it's done as a form of humiliation rather than done to be sexist and racist, as stated above, don't get into situations that may lead to hostility. Furthermore, trying to make this another OOC consent thing is just ridiculous, it is just another blockade for players to protect themselves behind to prevent them taking a form of loss. oh lastly, it costs like $1000 for a new hair style... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankieP Posted January 15, 2021 Report Share Posted January 15, 2021 Bro I promise you its not that deep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xoza Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 I don't think it offers anything to RP, at what time would you or anyone even bother doing it and why? There's really nothing to gain... I'd support removing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalvinKlein Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 9 hours ago, Xoza said: I don't think it offers anything to RP, at what time would you or anyone even bother doing it and why? There's really nothing to gain... I'd support removing it. it's part of criminal (hostile RP) and is a form of IC humiliation when there's RP leading up to it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAttlesnake7473 Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 Not once in my 350K xp playing time have I had my haircut by being caught lacking or robbed by an enemy gang. It's honestly not that hard, surround yourself with people that have your back and can shoot when needed. But would'nt mind the command to be like frisking /cuthair (ID) /approvecutihair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalvinKlein Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 2 hours ago, RAttlesnake7473 said: Not once in my 350K xp playing time have I had my haircut by being caught lacking or robbed by an enemy gang. It's honestly not that hard, surround yourself with people that have your back and can shoot when needed. But would'nt mind the command to be like frisking /cuthair (ID) /approvecutihair Heavily disagree as you already have tons of people stalling rp, if someone just uses the command with no rp report them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie_J Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 -1 NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
