RIP private labs

[Ritchie Stones]

many times i suggested to do something about selling drugs in smaller quantities like 5 per turf, and creating much more smaller turfs.
while this could have created much more RP for everyone including for cops.
but everyone remained stuck on the negativity around private labs.

there is nothing wrong with having people sit for 1-2 hours in a private lab if that means they would go outside and spend another hour selling it off.
but instead, we completely ignored the fact that the main issue is that you can sell 250 drugs in 5 seconds and take of like nothing happened.

i hope we come to realize rather soon than later, that forcing crims to go in public labs is not going to do much good either.
its going to turn into a call of duty lab reporting each other out of the city, which it has been already for the past few years.
we did not got rid of the clappers mentality. clappers just left or got banned along with a fair amount of crims who where valuable to the RP experience.
that is not solving the issue, its just the issue being pushed under the doormat hoping will stay there unnoticed.

so much more could have been done about private labs that could glorify it, instead, we pushed it under trying to look back at the old days of public labs.
stop thinking so small, eclipse could be so much bigger, but do the thinking work.

no disrespect is intended to the server, I am however a bit disappointed that instead of pushing the boundaries of great ideas, was instead slowly cut off and died a slow depressing death.
I also don't want complaints in the comments but instead great minds with great ideas.


 

[Ritchie Stones]

On the other side of this, if soon planting marijuana plants becomes available to plant al around the map. I can see very big blowup in RP, because plants will be very abundant item and manny wil try to rush with their fresh plants to public labs in order to create their drugs. Making public labs a hotspot like no tomorrow, that would look very promising,

- even if you could make plants in your backyard it would still make it that everyone will be spending time in labs to make the product. And everyone will feel the prosperity and make some good money. If this doesn't work im done im out of inspiration  

 

[chadman567]

im with Ritchie on this let us make our own weed in our yards and such. it would make RP reasons to go to labs to create more drug scenes with cops

but also i thing the active labs at once needs increased to 7

 

[Ritchie Stones]

55 minutes ago, chadman567 said:

im with Ritchie on this let us make our own weed in our yards and such. it would make RP reasons to go to labs to create more drug scenes with cops

but also i thing the active labs at once needs increased to 7

 

imagine !!! planting everywhere on the map, the gangs scouting around, and then still after everything you have to go to labs, to create the product, all I see is a fully crouded server map full of RP, I hope they get going with it, it will even return old players, because we kinda want to have this form of freedom yet risk, and also be profitable. it look promising

 

[Demonmit1]

Players should be able to seed and grow weed anywhere on the map (in the dirt on the ground) and have private grow operations. Players should also be able to place and run cooking tables anywhere on the map, removing the ability to place tables in instanced locations like RVs.

[Ritchie Stones]

40 minutes ago, Demonmit1 said:

Players should be able to seed and grow weed anywhere on the map (in the dirt on the ground) and have private grow operations. Players should also be able to place and run cooking tables anywhere on the map, removing the ability to place tables in instanced locations like RVs.

I doubt they will allow growing plants in your backyards, since the concept has been very much demonised, however i think it would make production of plants more populair,  also for people scouting around more populair, it doesn't matter if its private or everywhere in the map, it will create a boom of RP regardless. 
 

anyhow.. people will storm labs anyway for making the finished product, and even make selling plants person to person far more common FOR SURE so thats a win no doubt, 

 

[Superdizzle78]

Show me in the real world a "Public" drug lab lmao Nobody cooks drugs in public lol.

[Bala]

Show me in the real world where someone respawns when they die, besides Jesus lol.

[Danny_V]

Love the work you did mate @Bala. they look amazing

[Ritchie Stones]

11 hours ago, Bala said:

Show me in the real world where someone respawns when they die, besides Jesus lol.

hhahaha XD what do you think of my suggestion under my long ass complain ? i wanna know from you some intake man, its the comment with the plants, I saw you uploaded 30 places for possible drug labs, so this would be a nice adding to the game, and if not, why would it not be a great idea ? if I could know more about it maybe not being a good idea for balance reasons, then I can adjust my ideas

[Bala]

I'm not a developer my guy, I just make holes in walls and put interiors in the holes. I fill holes @Ritchie Stones

Bala the Hole Filler.

[Ritchie Stones]

26 minutes ago, Bala said:

I'm not a developer my guy, I just make holes in walls and put interiors in the holes. I fill holes @Ritchie Stones

Bala the Hole Filler.

AAAAH HAHAHA

[Jett_J]

I think people don't see the point of the update.

These updates are designed to increase the number of interactions on the server and the number of people around. The map is pretty big for our server population so when people are cooking in an RV or house, it makes the server look like it has less players especially since we don't have NPCs. A bunch of new MLOs have been added and they will create new opportunities for criminals in addition to more labs.

[Bala]

2 hours ago, Jett_J said:

I think people don't see the point of the update.

These updates are designed to increase the number of interactions on the server and the number of people around. The map is pretty big for our server population so when people are cooking in an RV or house, it makes the server look like it has less players especially since we don't have NPCs. A bunch of new MLOs have been added and they will create new opportunities for criminals in addition to more labs.

I think you've summed up the thinking behind it for the most part.

The other flip side of it is that, a lot of the server is just constant repetition. With labs it was like the same 6-7 places more or less and a lot of those places have been drug spots for 5+ years, so it's like hamsters running around a wheel.

So, having not just different but in-world environments to do this stuff in is a fresh take on an old favourite.

Plus, elephant in the room, there is an accusation that PD and SD camp labs, right? Now, whether that is right or wrong, adding an extra 30+ locations in some ways makes camping quite impossible. It also means that on occasion cops will probably find someone as there are more public locations too.

I've had queries of why I'd put labs in the middle of the city and the answer is simple, to challenge you. If you wanna start shooting shit up like it's the Alamo and you're doing it downtown, what you think is going to happen? So, if one of those labs is in the rotation, you've got to keep a lower profile.

[Ritchie Stones]

5 hours ago, Jett_J said:

I think people don't see the point of the update.

These updates are designed to increase the number of interactions on the server and the number of people around. The map is pretty big for our server population so when people are cooking in an RV or house, it makes the server look like it has less players especially since we don't have NPCs. A bunch of new MLOs have been added and they will create new opportunities for criminals in addition to more labs.

Fair point and i am 100% for personal interaction!! However, my point is, people cooking in a backyard, is no issue. But they missed out on a lot of opportunity all those years around selling the product spread over the map.

[Quietthecutie]

On 8/9/2024 at 4:31 PM, Jett_J said:

I think people don't see the point of the update.

These updates are designed to increase the number of interactions on the server and the number of people around. The map is pretty big for our server population so when people are cooking in an RV or house, it makes the server look like it has less players especially since we don't have NPCs. A bunch of new MLOs have been added and they will create new opportunities for criminals in addition to more labs.

Ye ive banged this drum so many times but people dont seem to grasp the concept.

The server wants to focus on things that get people out on the map and interacting, not sitting in their own compartment of the server farming money. 

It would be a hell of alot easier were that not the case, but this is where we are and i understand the logic.

Edited August 11, 2024 by Quietthecutie

[power]

On 8/9/2024 at 6:49 PM, Bala said:

I've had queries of why I'd put labs in the middle of the city and the answer is simple, to challenge you. If you wanna start shooting shit up like it's the Alamo and you're doing it downtown, what you think is going to happen? So, if one of those labs is in the rotation, you've got to keep a lower profile.

I see and agree the vision of some of these spots but I can't help but feel like it's aimed at the wrong playerbase. ECRP has never had a criminal playerbase of people who are interested in being discreet when it comes to robbing or shooting people and I feel like these labs are another opportunity for crims to get creative, but instead we'll see it wasted and these labs that will more often then not result in arrests, being open for weeks, as people are less motivated to occupy and cook in those spots. Love the idea but I'm worried whether it'll work with this playerbase

Edited August 12, 2024 by power

[Ritchie Stones]

4 hours ago, power said:

I see and agree the vision of some of these spots but I can't help but feel like it's aimed at the wrong playerbase. ECRP has never had a criminal playerbase of people who are interested in being discreet when it comes to robbing or shooting people and I feel like these labs are another opportunity for crims to get creative, but instead we'll see it wasted and these labs that will more often then not result in arrests being open for weeks, as people are less motivated to occupy and cook in those spots. Love the idea but I'm worried whether it'll work with this playerbase

i think idd we have to wait and see, I am in this exact spot btw, I don't want to go towards those labs, its toxic as shit, just rob me and take my stuff, but for a fair amount of them its grouping up to be rude and disrespectful, and druglabs are the perfect excuse for them to get away with that, and I feel that, and I don't like it in any way.

besides that I liked the feeling of "investing" in drugtables and places to make my life more easy. it gave purpose and reason to keep pushing that boundary to the next level.
also I don't understand and I wish to understand that, 2-3 years ago I actually had far more interaction with people in many more different ways with those private labs being in full blown operation. but now that this has been fading over time I saw less and less interactions besides burgershot?? so I am actually confused.
how is it that when everyone was making good money everyone was out there doing something, but now that that's gone, I see everyone more divided than ever before ???.
like I'm really actually confused, times never that lonely in the server for me and I'm a guy who gets along easy 

[Bala]

12 hours ago, power said:

I see and agree the vision of some of these spots but I can't help but feel like it's aimed at the wrong playerbase. ECRP has never had a criminal playerbase of people who are interested in being discreet when it comes to robbing or shooting people and I feel like these labs are another opportunity for crims to get creative, but instead we'll see it wasted and these labs that will more often then not result in arrests being open for weeks, as people are less motivated to occupy and cook in those spots. Love the idea but I'm worried whether it'll work with this playerbase

ECRP might not have ever had the player base that WANTS to be discreet but they also never really needed to be. You could probably argue that Braddocks and Hole in the Wall were the most public because they're right along the main highway for SD but the others, they were pretty isolated and you could more or less do what you liked.

There is nothing to say that factions can't shoot up a lab in the city, there is just more scrutiny if you do it. You would probably have to shoot and scoot, rather than stay and spray. 

A downside to the old labs is that because they are isolated, you don't really have a shot when you go to one of them because you can get robbed and shot without anyone having a chance to know about it really. But do it in a city lab? Maybe someone does notice.

Another common accusation is that PD and SD patrolled labs. Now, whether or not that is true, that's incredibly easy when it's the same 6/7 locations for years and I could 100% see how the accusations of cops being in places they wouldn't normally be equals them meta-gaming. We could have put them all on the outskirts but then you might as well paint a sign that says drug lab.

The plan, at least for me, is to add new locations and remove current locations over time, because look at what this has done so far. People seem to be very intrigued by the new landscape of things and I'm delighted with the overall reaction so far.

8 hours ago, Ritchie Stones said:

i think idd we have to wait and see, I am in this exact spot btw, I don't want to go towards those labs, its toxic as shit, just rob me and take my stuff, but for a fair amount of them its grouping up to be rude and disrespectful, and druglabs are the perfect excuse for them to get away with that, and I feel that, and I don't like it in any way.

besides that I liked the feeling of "investing" in drugtables and places to make my life more easy. it gave purpose and reason to keep pushing that boundary to the next level.
also I don't understand and I wish to understand that, 2-3 years ago I actually had far more interaction with people in many more different ways with those private labs being in full blown operation. but now that this has been fading over time I saw less and less interactions besides burgershot?? so I am actually confused.
how is it that when everyone was making good money everyone was out there doing something, but now that that's gone, I see everyone more divided than ever before ???.
like I'm really actually confused, times never that lonely in the server for me and I'm a guy who gets along easy 

I'm going to be honest with you, it sounds a little bit like you don't like criminals acting like.. criminals? 
I'm not sure what you expect from people, to be honest, especially if you've been here for that long.

Try making a deal with factions, try playing smart with the labs, try all different kinds of alternative approaches but if you are expecting the server to accommodate you then you're going to be disappointed I'm afraid.

The simple fact is, you shutting yourself away in a private property or before it an Apartment Lab does nothing for the server and only does something for you. Unless you happen to get careless, your lab won't blow up and it's basically free money. How is that not isolating? It's just very easy and very safe.

Thanks to @Bakmeel and FM we have more official factions than we pretty much ever have, so why can't you maybe join up with one of them, if you're lonely? That is better for that faction, to grow by +1 member and it's better for you to have people to socialise with in general, besides doing just things like cooking drugs.

[Danny_V]

14 hours ago, Bala said:

ECRP might not have ever had the player base that WANTS to be discreet but they also never really needed to be. You could probably argue that Braddocks and Hole in the Wall were the most public because they're right along the main highway for SD but the others, they were pretty isolated and you could more or less do what you liked.

There is nothing to say that factions can't shoot up a lab in the city, there is just more scrutiny if you do it. You would probably have to shoot and scoot, rather than stay and spray. 

A downside to the old labs is that because they are isolated, you don't really have a shot when you go to one of them because you can get robbed and shot without anyone having a chance to know about it really. But do it in a city lab? Maybe someone does notice.

Another common accusation is that PD and SD patrolled labs. Now, whether or not that is true, that's incredibly easy when it's the same 6/7 locations for years and I could 100% see how the accusations of cops being in places they wouldn't normally be equals them meta-gaming. We could have put them all on the outskirts but then you might as well paint a sign that says drug lab.

The plan, at least for me, is to add new locations and remove current locations over time, because look at what this has done so far. People seem to be very intrigued by the new landscape of things and I'm delighted with the overall reaction so far.

I'm going to be honest with you, it sounds a little bit like you don't like criminals acting like.. criminals? 
I'm not sure what you expect from people, to be honest, especially if you've been here for that long.

Try making a deal with factions, try playing smart with the labs, try all different kinds of alternative approaches but if you are expecting the server to accommodate you then you're going to be disappointed I'm afraid.

The simple fact is, you shutting yourself away in a private property or before it an Apartment Lab does nothing for the server and only does something for you. Unless you happen to get careless, your lab won't blow up and it's basically free money. How is that not isolating? It's just very easy and very safe.

Thanks to @Bakmeel and FM we have more official factions than we pretty much ever have, so why can't you maybe join up with one of them, if you're lonely? That is better for that faction, to grow by +1 member and it's better for you to have people to socialise with in general, besides doing just things like cooking drugs.

I love the new locations, I don't love that they came at a price:

The server says it wants to promote different groups with different types of lore and backgrounds, yet with this change it forces everyone down the same path.
I understand this change will create more interactions, however there's only so many different types of interactions you realistically will have at a lab. (I honestly cannot count the amount of times someone was pretending to be nice only to drive off, grab a gun outside line of sight, return and telling me to hand over my stuff while i was mid script.. Such roleplay wow..) More of the same isn't really better, nor desirable, in my opinion.

If cooking in a private location was such a problem I feel it would have been a better approach to keep trying to balance it through different ways. Either through the timing of the cook, financial investment or maybe even trying something totally different (for example: by putting a professional cook npc in the public labs who you can pay to get better cook timers for a set amount of time). By tweaking these values players could have easily been incentivised to make a choice for going to a public lab. Instead now all choice has been taken away and the entire playerbase is forced to cook at a public lab, or not cook at all.

I feel like good RP comes from players having options, and that forcing all crims into one place "because crims love doing crim stuff" is just an overgeneralization. I get that the private labs have been a issue for a quite some time, but getting rid of it seems like giving up.  The new labs look sick, I love the fact there's new stuff added, it's just a shame it came with the price of having fewer roleplay options. I am quite surprised by the statement that forcing people into pvp zones is seen as "bringing something to the server" (realistically labs are treated as pvp zones, I hope we can all agree on that). These changes will require everyone that was privately cooking to take different approaches. it'll probably even be fun to find out what works and what the new status quo will be after this. What I do want to add however is that this change most definetly accomodates a certain portion of the playerbase and playstyle. We all know there's a certain portion of ECRP's playerbase that only flies in to have a gunfight, and flies out as soon as that fight is over. I feel this change could very much cater to this group of players and I feel it really doesn't bring any RP to an RP server. PvP is also an interaction, so yeah it'll probably bring interaction to the server.

Lastly, I heard stories about staff denying refund requests for lab equipment people have invested in, don't now if there's any truth to that but if it is, I sympathize with people now having spent a small fortune on what's essenatially overpriced furniture. (Does anyone know what an RV sells for nowadays?)
 

[Bala]

5 hours ago, Danny_V said:

I love the new locations, I don't love that they came at a price:

The server says it wants to promote different groups with different types of lore and backgrounds, yet with this change it forces everyone down the same path.
I understand this change will create more interactions, however there's only so many different types of interactions you realistically will have at a lab. (I honestly cannot count the amount of times someone was pretending to be nice only to drive off, grab a gun outside line of sight, return and telling me to hand over my stuff while i was mid script.. Such roleplay wow..) More of the same isn't really better, nor desirable, in my opinion.

If cooking in a private location was such a problem I feel it would have been a better approach to keep trying to balance it through different ways. Either through the timing of the cook, financial investment or maybe even trying something totally different (for example: by putting a professional cook npc in the public labs who you can pay to get better cook timers for a set amount of time). By tweaking these values players could have easily been incentivised to make a choice for going to a public lab. Instead now all choice has been taken away and the entire playerbase is forced to cook at a public lab, or not cook at all.

I feel like good RP comes from players having options, and that forcing all crims into one place "because crims love doing crim stuff" is just an overgeneralization. I get that the private labs have been a issue for a quite some time, but getting rid of it seems like giving up.  The new labs look sick, I love the fact there's new stuff added, it's just a shame it came with the price of having fewer roleplay options. I am quite surprised by the statement that forcing people into pvp zones is seen as "bringing something to the server" (realistically labs are treated as pvp zones, I hope we can all agree on that). These changes will require everyone that was privately cooking to take different approaches. it'll probably even be fun to find out what works and what the new status quo will be after this. What I do want to add however is that this change most definetly accomodates a certain portion of the playerbase and playstyle. We all know there's a certain portion of ECRP's playerbase that only flies in to have a gunfight, and flies out as soon as that fight is over. I feel this change could very much cater to this group of players and I feel it really doesn't bring any RP to an RP server. PvP is also an interaction, so yeah it'll probably bring interaction to the server.

Lastly, I heard stories about staff denying refund requests for lab equipment people have invested in, don't now if there's any truth to that but if it is, I sympathize with people now having spent a small fortune on what's essenatially overpriced furniture. (Does anyone know what an RV sells for nowadays?)
 

It doesn't change the outcome but the decision to remove private labs was made separately to the decision to add all these extra new locations. Paulius made the decision to remove the private labs and I suppose also made the decision to add the labs I gave to him, but the thinking behind what I wanted to achieve by adding new labs was separate.

The thinking behind the new locations was to give people new environments to explore and break the monotony of the same old stuff at the same old labs. I'm a law enforcement roleplayer and have been for the entirety of my time here, I got frustrated with the accusations that my faction is camping places like the lab in El Burro. Now, in some respects some labs are easier to discover but it's also more difficult to camp labs because it's a numbers game anyway.

Something I had to accept is that I can't please everyone and inevitably there is going to be some negative reactions or outcomes from this change. For those players that it negatively impacts you, I feel for you but at the same time, the vibe I've got so far is that it's a positive change. Time will obviously tell on that.

As long as the majority of people fuck with something, I feel like i've done my job.

[froncKela]

I've been in-active for like two or three years, one day I just started re-watching Breaking Bad, the TV series, and guess what, suddenly something rushed in, I downloaded the game just to fuck around, get some tables and start cooking in an RV.

I think it's not a bad thing that some people prefer to cook in their own private spots, in reality, who would go out and cook in public places and play with their lives? cooking under a lot pressure, waiting for outnumbered players to rob you, waiting for some random passing-by player to call cops on you and stuff.

Someone mentioned interaction with other players and gangs and how easy it is to sell lots of drugs at a time, alright, I'll tell you this:
If it's scriptable, give benefits to the drugs, let players actually USE drugs instead of selling them to an NPC,
this way you cook wherever you want, but will actually have to interact with other players and gangs, you'll have to sell to others in order to get your profit from the drugs that you cooked.

I mean, there's a lot things we can think about, but I still don't support the idea of not letting players cook privately.
Maybe I'm a guy who wants his name to remain clean, you go out to roll a joint and you're done.






 

Edited August 17, 2024 by froncKela

[Pazz]

5 hours ago, froncKela said:

If it's scriptable, give benefits to the drugs, let players actually USE drugs instead of selling them to an NPC,

 

[Paulius]

On 8/17/2024 at 5:25 PM, Pazz said:

 

Crazy that people commenting here and dont know this

[froncKela]

Well, yeah, I might be an exception since I've been in-active for quite long time, and I missed it, but still the rest of what I said remains the same,
Letting players sell drugs to players instead of NPCs would be quite an adventure, or just let only official gang members sell to NPCs.