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NexonBG

State of "Failure to pay a fine"

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Given that a lot of people have lives outside of ECRP, having PD tracking you moment you log in after few days of not being in the game just to arrest you for a failure to pay a fine seems only like making someone else suffer more. I was on the way to PD from eclipse to pay the fines. I was aware they were "outstanding", I had to log out shortly after receiving it and I wasnt logging in due to work related stuff. Having them to track you down immediatly isnt fun for anyone and adds on to list of "PD has win mentality". I dont see a problem if someone had an good reason / rp or OOC to let him go pay the ticke tand everyone goes on about their day. This isnt fun, this isnt good RP, this is just getting your ass targeted when you just want to log in for few hours to have fun with your friends.

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I find this thread baffling if I'm completely honest with you.

You talk about suffering, it's fifteen minutes in jail bro, you're not being CKed.
You talk about it not being good RP, it's a consequence of an IC action (to get the citation) and a consequence of another IC action (not paying the citation off).
There is the opportunity there to report it for review etc..

But, what exactly do you think PD is winning in this situation? It's a $1000 fine, that the PD will see none of. It's not like PD would be confiscating the WMDs or re-capturing El Chapo.

You know on the one hand, I think that extending the failure to pay charge up to a week (upping the fine to 1.5k/2k and being able to pay off fines via your phone would make sense for players but that's not my call to make.

If you're in a gang, then the police gang units are going to look to pull you on whatever they can, that's their goal. Your goal is be how you wanna be and their goal is when that crosses the legal line, to step in and stop you. Don't matter if it's a speeding ticket or a murder charge. The only distinction to make is legal or illegal.

There's no state of, you're just a victim of circumstance.

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6 hours ago, Bala said:

You talk about suffering, it's fifteen minutes in jail bro, you're not being CKed.
You talk about it not being

Its fifteen minutes in jail if you don't have gun / anything else that criminal have every day on him.

 

6 hours ago, Bala said:

But, what exactly do you think PD is winning in this situation? It's a $1000 fine, that the PD will see none of. It's not like PD would be confiscating the WMDs or re-capturing El Chapo.

They are abusing the situation to make it harded for a criminal in every aspect of playing. Ofcourse when you stop a criminal he is gonna have something on him.

6 hours ago, Bala said:

You know on the one hand, I think that extending the failure to pay charge up to a week (upping the fine to 1.5k/2k and being able to pay off fines via your phone would make sense for players but that's not my call to make.

This would make sense and would help a lot of people.

 

6 hours ago, Bala said:

You talk about it not being good RP, it's a consequence of an IC action (to get the citation) and a consequence of another IC action (not paying the citation off).

I dont see why if someone is RPing that he was on vacation, had to rush out of the city for few days, cops still ignoring everything on that and just focusing on arresting the person, getting 10 more cars and bikes on the scene just to fuck someone up. Its not good RP, its win mentality.

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If you're aware that you have outstanding tickets past the legal threshold, why are you driving to PD with illicit items on your person to pay those tickets off? This seems like it's very easily avoidable and has no need for any OOC intervention.

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Adding the "Failure to pay a fine" charge is normally up to the officer (**when they're higher ranking, lower ranks have to place it). A lot of times, if there's only one or two speeding tickets that are overdue, they give the person a chance to go pay the fines. If they have 5+ outstanding, are known to be gang affiliated, etc. it is more likely that they would be given that charge. At times, even if someone is gang affiliated, if they politely explain that they've been away for several days, officers might let them off with a warning or would escort them to pay the fines. Different cops would handle the situations in different ways and different divisions of LSPD (such as VTD) have different protocols that must be followed. 

At the end of the day, the charge has to be added manually and it all depends on who you run into, what the circumstances are, division protocols, etc. Most cops don't randomly search up names in the MDC to check if they can add charges like that to just anyone because there's normally something else that needs their attention, especially lately with the new ATM robbing and clothing/gun store robbing updates.

The only time you would get "hunted" by PD is if you have an outstanding warrant and there's an actual big reason for them to be after you. It's never over something small like failure to pay a fine.

You just got unlucky in this case.

 

With that being said, I do agree with Bala that possibly giving a longer time to pay a fine would be more accommodating for when someone has been unable to come online due to OOC issues. Adding the ability to pay the fine from your phone would be a good feature but would require dev changes, whereas the time to pay a fine would have to be a change in the penal code, which is an IC change and can be handled through IC means.

 

Keep in mind that my opinion is my own and does not reflect the opinion of the LSPD faction as a whole.

Edited by UrbanGhost
added some clarification
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1 hour ago, jason said:

you're aware that you have outstanding tickets past the legal threshold, why are you driving to PD with illicit items on your person to pay those tickets off?

Because im a criminal and at any point in time a situation can come up where i need those items. Because thhats how things work, i need to have a weapon in glovebox to have me to protect myself. Thinking there is no way that someone is gonna track me in 5 minuts of me heading to PD, it just doesnt make sense.

 

You are alk saying how i just got unlucky, but this isnt the first tike this is happening.

1 hour ago, UrbanGhost said:

Different cops would handle the situations in different ways and different divisions of LSPD (such as VTD) have different protocols that must be followed. 

I agree, i am not saying every cop is like that, but i am saying that 90% of cops wont understand the OOC limitation you had and will juse see to arrest you.

1 hour ago, UrbanGhost said:

.

The only time you would get "hunted" by PD is if you have an outstanding warrant and there's an actual big reason for them to be after you. It's never over something small like failure to pay a fine.

Tell me more, since they called 3 scouts, 1 crown vic and 1 BF since i was on BF and they knew i wanted to evade. So yeah, small failure to pay a fine, but they need 10 cops on the scene. Tickets were 1x500, 1x 1000 between 🙂

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4 minutes ago, NexonBG said:

Tell me more, since they called 3 scouts, 1 crown vic and 1 BF since i was on BF and they knew i wanted to evade. So yeah, small failure to pay a fine, but they need 10 cops on the scene. Tickets were 1x500, 1x 1000 between 🙂

That happens because you're a high profile criminal. The officer that pulled you over might have just asked for one additional unit but if there isn't a ton of other stuff going on (or DB is around and they wanna keep an eye on you) then more units will respond. I've done traffic stops before where I ask for one additional and I get three. I've been pulled over where the cop asked for one additional and got five. It's not about being hunted, they just know about your track record and take precautionary measures. 

 

Remember, I've been in Rooks and I'm in Royals with you. I have had to deal with the exact same thing. It's not about play to win, or being hunted, or anything like that. If you have a reputation, you have a reputation and they will request backup even for a normal traffic stop. A lot of times, they'd get more backup than they requested just from your name or your gang association alone.

 

Your vehicle doesn't even make a difference. I've been pulled over driving a Packer and ended up with two SWAT scouts, a DB unmarked crown vic and another PD scout parked up for a standard traffic stop, with another PD scout circling the area. I didn't even get a ticket from that traffic stop. Name, association, reputation, that all makes the difference. And I know for a fact that the officer only called for one additional when he performed the traffic stop.

 

So no, it's not about being hunted. It's part of being a criminal and having an extensive record.

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If you make the choice to carry illicit items on you while on your way to a police station while knowing you're wanted, that's nobody's fault but your own. Nothing is stopping you from putting that stuff away for the few minutes it takes to pay off your tickets or potentially be caught for not doing so.

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3 hours ago, jason said:

If you're aware that you have outstanding tickets past the legal threshold, why are you driving to PD with illicit items on your person to pay those tickets off? This seems like it's very easily avoidable and has no need for any OOC intervention.

Exactly this it tells you that you've got outstanding tickets to pay when you log in, if you think its been over 3 days then get a taxi and go pay them off simple as that or just avoid any busy roads if you drive.

Edited by apologisemeow
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This should be handled IC'ly through the government letterbox, no OOC intervention is needed here. In fact, I would likely support you IC'ly with regards to extending the time to be able to pay a fine or a change to the penal code stating that a chance to pay the fine has to be given to the RO of a vehicle (since these charges are sometimes added by scanning parked vehicles).

There is no ''they'' bogeyman here, we don't control the penal code, we enforce it.

2 hours ago, NexonBG said:

Because im a criminal and at any point in time a situation can come up where i need those items. Because thhats how things work, i need to have a weapon in glovebox to have me to protect myself. Thinking there is no way that someone is gonna track me in 5 minuts of me heading to PD, it just doesnt make sense.

That's fair enough, but that is your decision.  Getting pulled over and found with illegal items is just a direct consequence of your actions. Next time you might decide to take a safer approach and leave any illegal items in your property until after you pay the fine. No one forced you to drive around with illegal items on you. Especially not PD.

Edited by Cyrus Raven
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@UrbanGhosti agree with everything you said and i know that, i am not disregarding, but the whole situation where you log in after a stressfull few days to chill and then being sent to doc for multiple hours FEELS like being hunted down. The point of vehicles wasnt to stress how much they called, its the reason they immediately called a bf just so i dont have any chance to escape. Which is what i find as win mentality.

 

I may have gotten off the track tok much, but to get back to the line. 

The whole point of this was that it shows that some PD members. ( Vast majority ) of it doesnt care about OoC reasons some players have, this goes on to even when someone was limited of paying a ticket due to it. I sqw multiple times where pd ( gang unit to be precise ) would ignore OOC warning to not scream over multiple reasons ( child nearby, someone having game on speakers, someone sleeping ) and even without the reason, if someone says it oocly it should be respected. After all we are all here ti play a game. And if you are making it unjoyable due to your actions, somethings should be brought up.

 

I understand i am RP ing a crim. It was my fault for carrying a .50 in a bike ti PD, it was foolish of me to think that PD might have some empathy if someone wasnt in the city for a long time. But no, just because you are in a gang, lets make game worse for you in every aspect of it.

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Often times, it is no longer within the arresting officer's hands whether or not they want to arrest you for your outstanding citations.
There can only really be leniency if you don't have a charge applied already.

When you have a Failure to pay a fine misdemeanor warrant applied to your record through the MDC, there is no getting around that at that point. You could get pulled over by the nicest and most lenient cop, he would still have to bring you in as is, no matter if you have a good IC or OOC explanation for why you couldn't pay those tickets.

 

 

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1 hour ago, DoTo said:

Often times, it is no longer within the arresting officer's hands whether or not they want to arrest you for your outstanding citations.
There can only really be leniency if you don't have a charge applied already.

When you have a Failure to pay a fine misdemeanor warrant applied to your record through the MDC, there is no getting around that at that point. You could get pulled over by the nicest and most lenient cop, he would still have to bring you in as is, no matter if you have a good IC or OOC explanation for why you couldn't pay those tickets.

Which is a dumb idea/think it got implemented, everyone has their reasons. I know that before you could get away with it, but this one again proves a point thats its making gameplay harder for criminals yet again. 

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If there was no consequence to never paying your fines, they would be pointless.
If you fined someone for not paying their fines, again that would be pointless.

Jail time is the only thing that makes sense at that point. The citation is a warning for something, the jail is the consequence for not paying attention to the warning.

A three day window is going to depend on individuals. For example, if someone can only play weekends, they're potentially fucked, so changing it to seven days seems like a fair move for all parties and that's what we're after. It's not PD must win, it's that if you do something illegal and you are caught doing it, you get punished. 

If you don't do anything illegal, you don't get punished. If you don't get caught, you don't get punished but it's on you, not the cop. We react to you so the ball is always in your court.

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