Beet Posted November 11, 2021 Report Share Posted November 11, 2021 (edited) Having been on the server since Nov 2017, I have mixed feelings about the suggestion. I think that the issue boils down to is a conflicting interest between what staff are trying to achieve and the somewhat robotic system that is currently in place. What I mean by this is staff and players alike have a shared interest in keeping rule-breakers in check and punished when necessary. At the same time, there seems to be no room prima facie for staff to exercise their discretion in a free way that would be fair and be in-keeping with the goal of policing rule-breakers. I think the main issue that staff are presented with is the expectation that they should follow the guidelines to the letter. Whilst guidelines are a positive in trying to achieve equal punishment to all who break rules, they ironically do not necessarily achieve this fairness they set out to do. Rather, the guidelines defeat the objective by the means. I personally believe there needs to be a threshold test that should be applied when dishing out a punishment that can be assessed on a case by case decision. I would suggest that such a test be worded like "is the punishment in the guidelines fitting for this case and is it in the public interest of the server for this punishment to be issued?" Such an approach allows for a more subjective look at what punishment would fit a certain instance. For example, instead of just seeing a player was banned for deathmatching three times and issuing a permanent ban for the fourth the staff handling would move to see when the punishments were issued, what were the circumstances of the punishment and any other guiding factors to ensure the punishment they hand out is fair. I would notion that if a member of staff saw someone was punished two or three years ago that punishment would have less weight than a far more recent punishment and they would adjust any punishment issued accordingly. I believe that staff members should be given more decision making responsibility in their decisions than move to a punishment decay system that others have suggested. Edited November 11, 2021 by Beet 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osborn Posted December 13, 2021 Report Share Posted December 13, 2021 Hello! We're working on a system to improve our internal punishment guidelines and the type of punishment a player receives based on how old their previous punishments are. Currently, staff can and are encouraged to seek deviation to give a lesser punishment to someone who had e.g. DM #1 a year ago, so that they don't need to ban them when they are issuing DM #2. We however recognize that this isn't always being done, and relies too much on one's individual judgement - so we're working on a system that will consider certain punishments "old" after a year, and not have them weigh in by default on punishments. We'll make an announcement once we feel comfortable implementing this. Do note that this would not affect currently banned players, as they will need to appeal their bans as per usual and those who have been given a date on their appeals will need to wait until said date. 6 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor Zelias Posted December 14, 2021 Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 4 hours ago, FatherOsborn said: Hello! We're working on a system to improve our internal punishment guidelines and the type of punishment a player receives based on how old their previous punishments are. Currently, staff can and are encouraged to seek deviation to give a lesser punishment to someone who had e.g. DM #1 a year ago, so that they don't need to ban them when they are issuing DM #2. We however recognize that this isn't always being done, and relies too much on one's individual judgement - so we're working on a system that will consider certain punishments "old" after a year, and not have them weigh in by default on punishments. We'll make an announcement once we feel comfortable implementing this. Do note that this would not affect currently banned players, as they will need to appeal their bans as per usual and those who have been given a date on their appeals will need to wait until said date. So reading this it is a good improvement indeed. I'd love to see this in action. But also considering "1 year = old" is a bit too long? We all have made mistakes that could be considered DM/Meta gaming and such. I've seen couple of times this have happen with people. Like a person that stabbed someone at Pier as their RP character is "Insane" and they got a DM punishment for that but saw them self doing somewhat "RP" for it. So I will myself say check over the times for certain rules and start adding how severe the certain rule breaks are in the punishment text or add the link for the complaint. I have a VDM jail myself on my account and never done anything after that punishment. It was de-sync on my part and did not have a video of the situation since I got PMed 24 min after "Save POV"((old days)). And that made me get a VDM jail. It was on the high-way with desync and many more factors like snow and such being around. So lets say I get a DM punishment again for something stupid like a situation in either DOC that I am part of being a guard. Is it really deserved to be a ban because of my (V)DM punishment? Seeing as it would be "not a year" and get anohter one etc. Sorry if all I wrote made 0 sense I wrote it while tired and woke up to it being not posted. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lSpixsy Posted December 21, 2021 Report Share Posted December 21, 2021 +1 to punishments expiring after a certain amount of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmTurtle Posted December 31, 2021 Report Share Posted December 31, 2021 Howdy, thank you for the suggestion. It has been implemented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
