Architer Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 (edited) Before starting this suggestion, I would like to state that I will not state the player names on this suggestion as it will cause unnecessary arguments. 1) Building a case: I believe that the detectives or undercover police officers should have a case on a/multiple gang member(s) before doing things such as going undercover just to see what the gang is doing and calling for backup as soon as they see something minor in a gang HQ or turf. 2) Being able to be in a criminal and PD/SD faction at the same time: Due to the fact that they are not able to do this, they are only limited to going undercover and baiting criminals(which is actually funny) instead of doing some sort of RP of going into a gang to be a rat, building case files or do a huge bust while something big such as illegal transactions and etc. is going on. 3) PD/SD actually fearing for their lives/having something to lose: Due to the fact that not only is there no CK, since they do not lose anything except for maybe some bobby pins, burgers and some waters, they tend to always go undercover, get into situations while they are outnumbered and etc. 4) PD/SD TAC talking keybind: There have been some instances where while PD/SD is under gunpoint, talking or etc. they were at the same time talking in TAC as some people use the same key as the in game talking key which is "N" to use the push to talk. I believe that they should be using "P" when they talk in TAC so other players can be comfortable in doing serious actions and it can stop the people who do this completely. 5) Baiting criminals/gang members into doing a crime: I get that this also happens sometimes IRL but when was the last time you've actually seen this happen? Detectives placing vehicles into a HQ so when it gets pinned they would go in for the arrest just to give an attempted grand theft auto charge, detectives dressing up as gang members so they bait you into a chase hoping that they would get into a shootout so the people involved would get arrested and many many more that it would take so long to even explain. This can literally stop being a problem if cops actually did case files or were able to join a criminal F4 for undercover purposes to do huge busts/raids that would not only be fun RP for both sides involved due to the RP that had been done to get the evidence but it would be worth it. This post will be edited if I have any other suggestions about it. I would also love to hear opinions/suggestions on this post from players that can read this post objectively. Edited August 18, 2020 by Architer 3 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arabella Kirk Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eradicati0n Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 +1, anything to increase the amount of interesting, in-depth RP on the server. PD/SD have very high barriers to entry and for good reason. Not only do they uphold law within the city, they often undertake quite serious, RP heavy tasks. I think everyone, criminals included, would like to see some of this really in-depth, character-defining RP within the PD and SD faction threads respectively. This could lead into a huge RP scenarios involving taking down gang leaders, building cases, and even presenting a RICO case against those involved in front of a court, in the future. However if we want better RP for and from SD/PD, it would help to stop the boring, borderline non-RP of shouting at cops, getting in the way, asking stupid questions or just plain being a nuisance whenever you see them, whether its an arrest for murder or a stop to enforce a mask violation. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankieP Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 (edited) Huge +1 Criminals should also be allowed to join 2 illegal factions if they have a strong reason that has been presented to Faction Management and approved Edited August 18, 2020 by FrankieP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamattos13 Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bala Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 Before starting this suggestion, I would like to state that I will not state the player names on this suggestion as it will cause unnecessary arguments. 1) Building a case: I believe that the detectives or undercover police officers should have a case on a/multiple gang member(s) before doing things such as going undercover just to see what the gang is doing and calling for backup as soon as they see something minor in a gang HQ or turf. I'm not in investigations, but how do you build a case on someone if you aren't allowed to investigate how they spend their time? I'm also not sure what you would consider as minor, but if it's a criminal act, in-character we are duty bound to put a stop to it and calling for back-up is a way of showing fear for personal safety, which you have referenced in another one of your points. 2) Being able to be in a criminal and PD/SD faction at the same time: Due to the fact that they are not able to do this, they are only limited to going undercover and baiting criminals(which is actually funny) instead of doing some sort of RP of going into a gang to be a rat, building case files or do a huge bust while something big such as illegal transactions and etc. is going on. While I agree that people going down this route would create some interesting role-play scenarios, it would die on the first day. For the sad reason that people would inevitably loophole using OOC information about a person and use that as a way of blocking them out of getting anything interesting done. The only plausible way to do it would be to agree to do this with the PD and then join the criminal faction first. Once it was time to make the case, you could hit the gang with the surprise motherfucker treatment. But you could then only do that the once, because once you did it to one faction, everyone else would hear about it and I guarantee the next day you'd have people trying all sorts to of questionable metagamey stuff to prevent that happening to them. 3) PD/SD actually fearing for their lives/having something to lose: Due to the fact that not only is there no CK, since they do not lose anything except for maybe some bobby pins, burgers and some waters, they tend to always go undercover, get into situations while they are outnumbered and etc. I see this complaint quite a bit and to be completely truthful, OOC, I could care less about my character getting killed but in-character, if i'm in a situation I know I cannot handle, I'm backing off and calling for backup. OOC, I respawn and it's no big deal. IC, I'm going to do everything I can to not die but at the same time, I have to role-play my line of duty. That being said though. You as a criminal, you are driving your personal vehicle. You are wearing your personal clothes with your pockets full of your personal items. In your wallet is your personal money and if you get caught doing something illegal, you lose your personal time. When I am on duty, I'm driving my government issued vehicle. I'm wearing my government issued clothes and i'm armed with government issued weapons. My pockets are empty, my wallet is empty. You have the freedom as a criminal to conduct yourself however you wish to, where as me as a cop, I have strict procedures and protocols to abide by. I cannot do do anything to you, unless you do something to me first. The price for that freedom to act is that, if you die or get caught, you lose more than I do. The incentive should be to not get caught. If you are talking about having something to lose, then really you are asking us to lose things just to lose them, not because it makes sense for us to. Cops can of course carry their personal items if they wish, but considering the nature of our role in the server, you would be foolish if you did that. 4) PD/SD TAC talking keybind: There have been some instances where while PD/SD is under gunpoint, talking or etc. they were at the same time talking in TAC as some people use the same key as the in game talking key which is "N" to use the push to talk. I believe that they should be using "P" when they talk in TAC so other players can be comfortable in doing serious actions and it can stop the people who do this completely. This is more a server rule issue. The flip side of that is people continuing to talk on their radio when cops have guns on them or switching their radio frequencies in situations you wouldn't want to do things with their hands. If people are doing these kind of things, on either side, they need to be punished and for that, they should be reported. 5) Baiting criminals/gang members into doing a crime: I get that this also happens sometimes IRL but when was the last time you've actually seen this happen? Detectives placing vehicles into a HQ so when it gets pinned they would go in for the arrest just to give an attempted grand theft auto charge, detectives dressing up as gang members so they bait you into a chase hoping that they would get into a shootout so the people involved would get arrested and many many more that it would take so long to even explain. This can literally stop being a problem if cops actually did case files or were able to join a criminal F4 for undercover purposes to do huge busts/raids that would not only be fun RP for both sides involved due to the RP that had been done to get the evidence but it would be worth it. As far as what detectives do in terms of case files, I've had the same amount of days in Investigations as you have so I can't comment on the specifics of what they do. As for some of the situations that you've mentioned, I think the danger is that that people are unable to distinguish between those incidents happening in isolated instances and it just being what Investigations do. I do know for a fact that every member of IB for example puts in an incredible amount of out-of-game work on the government forums building up cases and collecting evidence on organisations and people. As someone like myself that has been in PD and made some mistakes, I think you should perhaps be a little more understanding that sometimes people let themselves down. A lot of my reply is defending what my faction does, but I think it comes down to perhaps seeing more of the picture than you guys as criminals get to, or maybe sometimes even want to. It's fine for PD to be the enemy IC, but we have to make sure that it doesn't get personal OOC which for some people it can and it clouds people's judgement. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machete Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 (edited) Over 80% of admins are in there. Don't expect changes. Only PD suggestions are looked and and i'm speaking from experience. They complain about criminals shooting at cops while they instigate everything. Never have they tried any negotiation RP other than hands hands hands and hero cop rushing into the situation. They are too arrogant to acknowledge that there's a serious problem. If people came here to Roleplay instead of trying to win every situation than it it would be a good place Edited August 18, 2020 by NM369 7 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamron Bridges Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 (edited) +1 in regards to pd needing to self police itself more and people need ooc punishments (cops) for not fearing for their lives and running headfirst into a 1v6. I've witness this happen FAR Too many times to count and its just absolutely mind blowing the lack of caring for your own life as a police officer on this server. No punishment for cops who don't do this, and it just feeds into the "WIN" mentality and makes it no fun for crims. As crims not only do they risk so much so often, but fall under much stricter guidelines with things like this for some reason (even though they shouldn't). Edited August 18, 2020 by Slamron Bridges 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bala Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 Over 80% of admins are in there. Don't expect changes. We have 17 people in our administration team, of which 6 are not in the Police Department which is 64, not over 80% is it? In terms of our Head Admins, one is in charge of illegal factions and two of the others are in charge of all government factions IC. Saying things like "Don't expect changes." -- Probably not with that attitude Keanu. Only PD suggestions are looked and and i'm speaking from experience. They complain about criminals shooting at cops while they instigate everything. Every situation where criminals shoot at cops, is because cops instigate that? Seems a reasonable deduction. Never have they tried any negotiation RP other than hands hands hands and hero cop rushing into the situation. They are too arrogant to acknowledge that there's a serious problem. If people came here to Roleplay instead of trying to win every situation than it it would be a good place Interesting, because had you been anything more involved in PD than just a regular cop, you probably would of gotten to have taken part in some of our hostage situations or swat operations where a lot of thought goes into not just how they are ran but also consideration of how true to life, things are. Sometimes things perhaps don't get taken care of and the PD always doesn't always acknowledge the other side. But are you seriously going to tell me, that community members with attitudes like the one you are displaying in this thread, are thinking of anyone else's side but their own? Anyones interests, but their own? You've already stretched the truth twice in your post regarding the amount of cop admins (although why that would even be an issue when they've earned their spots) and the amount cops instigate shootouts. Personally, I don't think it's cop admins that are holding the server back, it's people with attitudes like yours. I took the time above to answer Architer's points respectfully and truthfully, then you decide that this is going to be your moment to stick the knife in. Perhaps you need to consider your own role within our roleplay community and whether your a part of a potential solution or whether you are perpetuating the same kinds of problems you are complaining about. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qiang Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eradicati0n Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 Over 80% of admins are in there. Don't expect changes. Only PD suggestions are looked and and i'm speaking from experience. They complain about criminals shooting at cops while they instigate everything. Never have they tried any negotiation RP other than hands hands hands and hero cop rushing into the situation. They are too arrogant to acknowledge that there's a serious problem. If people came here to Roleplay instead of trying to win every situation than it it would be a good place I really don't think this is an accurate portrayal of the problem within PD/SD. I've been stopped by police many times, on both my legal and illegal characters. I've been stopped for everything from speeding to carrying an unlicensed firearm, and its always been obvious to me that the scenario is dictated by how I act. Sure, I could kick up a fuss and escalate the scenario, but sometimes it just isn't worth it. Crim RP isn't in the best state right now, but I think a lot of Crims could benefit from the knowledge that, though they may be criminals, they don't have to hate PD and don't have to escalate every single scenario. Turning a mask stoppage into an arrest is pretty poor RP imo, yet it happens regularly. On my Criminal character, I've been stopped outside bank for an unlicensed firearm and let go because I complied. I've also been arrested for Armed Robbery, yet the officer was in fairly good spirits due to me complying with him, and it turned into quite a good RP scenario. The same officer even spoke to me after I got out of DOC to check how my time was and advise me on how to not go down the criminal path, which I think is much deeper RP than just trying to "win every situation". Unfortunately, if you perpetuate poor RP as a Crim, you'll most likely receive the same 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arnis Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 Most times PD dosent want to rp theres some people who are down to rp bust most times just proces and go further same with guards they dont interact with none they just sit on there catwalk and look at us all do nothing else is done and if your raided its probably the same rutine thing not even asking if he maybe knows some rumors in prison or anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruble Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WernerBerg Posted August 20, 2020 Report Share Posted August 20, 2020 4) PD/SD TAC talking keybind: There have been some instances where while PD/SD is under gunpoint, talking or etc. they were at the same time talking in TAC as some people use the same key as the in game talking key which is "N" to use the push to talk. I believe that they should be using "P" when they talk in TAC so other players can be comfortable in doing serious actions and it can stop the people who do this completely. I agree with this, there's a lot of situations which I was talking in TAC by holding N and the player that I was RPing with was confused that who I was talking to. Most of the time I try to hold P for talking but since it's a bit far away from the other keys I don't use it in all the situations. I an OOC rule for holding P for talking in TAC should reslove this problem, but tbh this is not a major thing and you do not see this "officers talking on TAC while they're under gunpoint". -1 to other parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justpositivity Posted August 21, 2020 Report Share Posted August 21, 2020 90% of Charges that these cops place on us realistically wouldn't go through IRL. One of my fellow gang members got accessory to every single crime of another person because he took them to MD. Like what the fuck? The law system is unstable and unfair! a lot of the times these cops place charges based on how they feel. If they hate/dislike you they double the charges knowing that you will be spending 5-10 hours in jail which is more of an OOC punishment. that's longer than a fucking DM punishment. They refuse to understand what the opposing side is trying to say. Then running up and start blasting as if there's no consequences. Their needs to be some sort of consequence for PD to make everything balanced! 150 members in PD compared to the 40 that official factions are limited to. I don't understand how some of you think that everything is balanced between PD and criminals. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ak47 Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaNd Posted September 29, 2020 Report Share Posted September 29, 2020 This is true +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaNd Posted September 29, 2020 Report Share Posted September 29, 2020 I agree completely because there are some cops who just dont care about there lives with no punishment +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
