Serthon Posted April 21, 2019 Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 I don't quite understand where the fuss about "not trusting IA" is coming from. Internal Affairs Reports are taken very seriously, as mention probably ten times before. All cases are handled impartially, conclusions go through IA Command, everything is checked over etc. Yes, the response times are not as fast as you'd think, but our response times have sped up recently, it might not be significantly, but we are trying our best. There are times when an investigation can take maybe less than a few days, and there are occasions where an investigation can take over a week. This all varies with each report. In conclusion, I find it hypocritical that there are people that complain about officers being unfair and with a Play-to-Win attitude, but they choose not to report it because they don't "trust IA". If you wish for something to happen, then a good start would be reporting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizzidy Posted April 21, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Knoxi said: Yes, and not every one of those 387 people are committing crimes on a regular basis... It does take time to get to a scene, be that a minute or ten, or calls go unanswered because we simply do not have enough units to cover everything that goes on in the city. The police are already wiped out on a somewhat regular basis because criminals join up against the police. Nerf the police for what? I already stated we make things as fair as possible. We could just go back and give every officer a carbine and say, "only follow server rules" and let me know how much better that will be. You can't compare Eclipse to IRL when a large majority of the civilians play it as structured GTA:Online. We have to do what we can until everyone is up to the same standard. This has to stop being a Police VS. Community thing, we're all here to RP. I have already stressed it enough if someone is not living up to our standard, we can fix that by getting them reported to us through IA. Now you are seeing it as a nerf, more proof of the win lose mentality. I just want a more realistic and engaging experience by making the NPC life matter and forcing proper engagement for 1 officer on 3 people. He would call backup, set up a perimeter, identify and respond accordingly. In GTA stores only have 1 door so blocking the exit aside from being unrealistic is game mechanic abuse, on top of that I want police to respond in accordance to the life at stake, and my suggestion does not even point to them being hostages, it is just that police should not engage a target while they have a gun pointed at a person's head. It does happen and real life and it makes the whole police chase/negotiation phase trash because its just an officer saying I am going to shoot you when you come out if you dont completely surrender right now even though you have the advantage of a life they are supposed to be duty bound to protect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizzidy Posted April 21, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, Serthon said: I don't quite understand where the fuss about "not trusting IA" is coming from. Internal Affairs Reports are taken very seriously, as mention probably ten times before. All cases are handled impartially, conclusions go through IA Command, everything is checked over etc. Yes, the response times are not as fast as you'd think, but our response times have sped up recently, it might not be significantly, but we are trying our best. There are times when an investigation can take maybe less than a few days, and there are occasions where an investigation can take over a week. This all varies with each report. In conclusion, I find it hypocritical that there are people that complain about officers being unfair and with a Play-to-Win attitude, but they choose not to report it because they don't "trust IA". If you wish for something to happen, then a good start would be reporting it. I did report it to IA and what I am saying is IA do not issue server bans and therefore the punishments for game breaking and role play ruining actions are taken lightly even at their worst. If you look through this post everyone says this should be a discussion EXCEPT the police.... because everyone knows how little role play you can expect from an actual police arrest. I just think this should be demanded and enforced through server rules like everything else, and not kept in house because it is a server problem and a mechanical problem. Not an IA thing. It is not police behavior, it is the rules of the server OOC enforcing these actions by making the NPCS considered a non factor. Also as mentioned several IA reports are still pending and I can bet my soul no policy or game changing actions will come of it, at worst an officer might get talked to, that is not sufficient to solve the over-arching problem of the robbery experience. We are expected to role play in detail with an NPC for 15 minutes because new things just keep popping up, fingerprints cctv that should be closed circuit now backs up to a cloud making it definitely not cctv, the NPC can identify us.... funny he can be used to identify people when he is not considered a life by the server rules. He can't defend himself until the police need a win... but we do it, we do it all, cover every base, form a plan for escape, and in a moment it is shattered because we dont have functioning windows or back doors and police are allowed to ignore the NPC as a life and also shove their car against the only functioning exit.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldari Posted April 21, 2019 Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 Quote at worst an officer might get talked to Within the past month multiple people have been suspended, removed from the faction and even issued server punishments directly due to IA reports. This is just not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizzidy Posted April 21, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Aldari_Tagril said: Within the past month multiple people have been suspended, removed from the faction and even issued server punishments directly due to IA reports. This is just not true. How many have been banned from the server? Edit: Also can we get this topic moved to suggestions because I don't want people to think its anything but. I am not trying to raise an army or start a war, just suggest something I think would make the server better, by starting with what I see which is making police follow a different standard of server rules not just their IA. Respect NPC life... and encourage more interactions and less shooting, because I feel the current way things are done only encourage people to bring lots of guns and kill the police which I think is equally boring and trashy as the police blocking doors and ignoring the NPC... All of it needs to be held to a firmer server rule in my opinion because I want this to be more fun... Edited April 21, 2019 by Wizzidy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knoxi Posted April 21, 2019 Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 29 minutes ago, Wizzidy said: It is not police behavior, it is the rules of the server OOC enforcing these actions by making the NPCS considered a non factor. Also as mentioned several IA reports are still pending and I can bet my soul no policy or game changing actions will come of it, at worst an officer might get talked to, that is not sufficient to solve the over-arching problem of the robbery experience. We are expected to role play in detail with an NPC for 15 minutes because new things just keep popping up, fingerprints cctv that should be closed circuit now backs up to a cloud making it definitely not cctv, the NPC can identify us Erm, you see, the thing is we can change protocol to fix some of these things. I'm currently in the process of re-writing the entire handbook... It's not fair for the majority of officers that follow our RP standards, to get lumped in with a few rotten apples. If you play at certain times of the day, I can agree that we are lacking supervisors, we're working hard to get as best coverage as possible. 1 minute ago, Wizzidy said: How many have been banned from the server? I've been in the LSPD for nearly two years, I've seen at least several people banned for various reasons. If someone breaks a server rule, the admins are bound by their punishment guideline, meaning if someone does something, they would be punished like any other player equally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldari Posted April 21, 2019 Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 Quote How many have been banned from the server? I'm not sharing that, because it doesn't matter, but people have been banned or issues server punishments through IA reports or normal forum reports, you just never see it, because that's not public information, but if you want to you can go onto the LSPD website and look at the discharges and demotions sections. You will see quite a lot of people have been demoted in the faction or even removed for OOC reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizzidy Posted April 21, 2019 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2019 (edited) The people who play police and the rest of the server are probably not going to agree on this and that is okay so Ill make this my final post because I don't think I am changing any of your minds and you aren't changing the minds of the people who +1ed this... it is a polarizing issue and I don't want it to turn into bad blood. Here is the thing, I get that you have IA, but if you are not abusing this by ramming your car up against the wall or running into the store while people are still holding a gun at the clerk, this wouldn't affect your negatively because you are not one of the "bad apples" I keep hearing about. My suggestion and my feeling is that its not cool that cops get to police their OOC behavior while the rest of the server is bound by a rule that negatively affects their actions. So with that aside I will state that I think it would be to the benefit of the server to have certain things changed OOC to correct some of the "bad apples" so there is no reason to put the responsibility in the hands of those it may benefit and keep temptation aside, as all other factions have policies too, but certain things should be server rules. Right now there is a rule that makes the NPC not considered a life, I am not saying remove it, I am saying expand upon it and make him not usable as a hostage, but still valued so cops have to wait for the gun to be off of the clerk. I also insist that ramming your car against any door in this server is powergaming unless you have enough squad cars to cover the back door as well, because you are using the fact that you know the back doors do not open as a game advantage to achieve the game you want. Whatever may come from this I want the police to know I do value them the same as any other and respect that they do so much to police their in game behaviors, but I think this is an OOC problem that can be handled with OOC solutions that can only negatively affect abuse. Thank you guys Edit: can we please get this moved to suggestions where I intended it to be q.q Edit: Remember this suggestion had nothing to do with, and actively discourages conversation of cops weaponry or funding, this suggestion is strictly about the interactions of cops at robberies and how they can be improved. Edited April 22, 2019 by Wizzidy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linden Posted April 22, 2019 Report Share Posted April 22, 2019 On 4/18/2019 at 9:11 AM, Copperhorse said: LSPD should have a treasury like the rest of us and have to actually buy pistols shotguns armor etc. On NGRP factions had to use their funds to buy high-grade materials, then everything cost varying amount of materials to take out. The problems with this is: having people available to deliver the materials (it was San Andreas Armed Services) people stealing those crates (which happened a lot, because >80% of civilians were major criminals) running out of materials and nobody being able to get anything from the lockers The third point occurred every few days because of the points 1 & 2, and because getting new equipment after dying gets expensive when >80% of the server would gladly kill you if it meant avoiding a $500 ticket. Even if you ignore the delivery of crates and just make guns remove money from the treasury, how much money do they currently have and how much do they earn? They need a stable source of income which means criminals complying or getting caught. Server staff isn't going to want a system that allows criminals to steal weapons from police, or a system that can leave the police with an empty armoury and massively drained treasury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
November Posted April 22, 2019 Report Share Posted April 22, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Linden said: On NGRP factions had to use their funds to buy high-grade materials, then everything cost varying amount of materials to take out. The problems with this is: having people available to deliver the materials (it was San Andreas Armed Services) people stealing those crates (which happened a lot, because >80% of civilians were major criminals) running out of materials and nobody being able to get anything from the lockers The third point occurred every few days because of the points 1 & 2, and because getting new equipment after dying gets expensive when >80% of the server would gladly kill you if it meant avoiding a $500 ticket. Even if you ignore the delivery of crates and just make guns remove money from the treasury, how much money do they currently have and how much do they earn? They need a stable source of income which means criminals complying or getting caught. Server staff isn't going to want a system that allows criminals to steal weapons from police, or a system that can leave the police with an empty armoury and massively drained treasury. Thank you for this perspective. I can tell you right now that there is absolutely no way PD could afford to buy weapons and ammunition with their treasury as the server works now, as I pointed out in my earlier response. I am fairly certain it tanks after salary payouts every week. This is, like you said, in large part due to an unrealistic lack of compliance. PD detains 1 gang member on suspicion, and without knowing anything about the scene, 20 gang members show up and just shoot all the cops. And even if the guy was being arrested? killing several cops just so one guy can avoid 45 days in a jail cell? really? Cops cannot lose their weapons every time and have to buy new ones. Can you imagine how many police weapons would be out in the open world now? someone gave a statistic of police should lose 75% of the time. In that case it would be a constant stream of military grade weapons into the gang world and the US would become anarchy. That is not roleplay, because it is nowhere close to what is happening IRL right now. Edited April 22, 2019 by November Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicklaseldal Posted May 2, 2019 Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 (edited) I feel that they're misusing their power aswell, they act like they want. I will post a couple pictures here of me trying to get my vehicle out, after serving a sentense. the red boxes is me, and the blue boxes are officers, most of the conversation from the polices part, was done through VOIP. - The officers ensured me that no person could get out their vehicles with any tickets what so ever. so if anyone had a vehicle out of impound, while having tickets unpaid please comment because i have had that myself plenty times. i feel like the police are making the law as they go, and bend it to the extend they feel like it. sometimes you wont be able to get your vehicle out from impound if you have a ticket, while others you will. I honstly got mad OOC because i waited for 30 minutes for a officer to show up, with the message to me being "go to mission row and pay your two tickets if you want your car out". https://imgur.com/a/RCkZTh0 https://imgur.com/a/uyVXba0 https://imgur.com/a/nXxZkiE https://imgur.com/a/wEyxWRG https://imgur.com/a/Xrg2fyA https://imgur.com/a/tuZQdfi This is not fair.... like i said. if you ever had a vehicle out, while still having unpaid tickets, comment or something so that mods can see that there is a issue with police and having a set of rules to follow, so that they wont treat people differently. Should be able to get unique timestamp if needed Edited May 2, 2019 by nicklaseldal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGanja Posted May 2, 2019 Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 I play other RP games, like Arma for example. Cops on their get a cheaper loadout to buy, but inevitably still have to purchase the gear. If it's robbed, they need a new set. I think it could be good to have them at least pay a small chunk for their loadouts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
