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DrBeelz

DM for police for small crimes

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55 minutes ago, Cyrus Raven said:

Did you end up submitting a court case for that situation?

Yes, but as a player you can, especially if you suspect corruption considering it is is OOC'ly not allowed unless under very specific guidelines and only an extremely limited amount of people can gain this status. For this you have OOC IA reports as well as regular player reports. Keep in mind that regardless of IC protocol, OOC rules come first, which means if you feel like you've been DMed you can report that person like any other player.

Lastly, the chart I showed above should at least be proof enough that the statement ''I don't believe any of these IC reports work for IA'', is untrue. You can check the links I provided, IA reports get sustained every single month and Officer's get suspended, both high-rank members and regular Officers. How can you claim these things don't work when evidence says otherwise? It might just be that for your specific scenario there was either a lack of evidence, no breach of IC regulations occurred or that IA had a different opinion from yours. If you suspect any bias or corruption in any of your IA outcomes, OOC report them for corruption with whatever evidence you have.

Yes I submitted it but it then got denied I then followed it up but they were just repeating what the charge was after I kept showing them the footage of them lying about it but I found myself talking to a broken record as nothing I said changed them just repeating the charge.

Ok here's an example (I'm not going to name any names) I had a high ranking PD officer arrest me under what he said RS to which was completely fabricated and I let him blabber on trying to convince me of something I didn't do and saying he saw me with a sultan that was speeding of which I also had dashcam of the sultan he was on about but it was so far away from me so he lied about me racing it after I let him run his mouth he arrested me I told him not to search my vehicle which he needed PC and he said ill find the PC (that's admitting he didn't have PC and not to his knowledge yet I have dashcam of the lies that he said to disprove what he said so I know he had no real PC or RS) while searching my car he said it doesn't matter as I will find something illegal in there. he then locked me away for no reason because I guess he was mad he didn't find anything I then submitted that to the court and showed all of his comments disproven by the dashcam so he lied about the reason he had RS and him admitting he didn't have RS or PC. the reason my court case got denied was apparently I admitted to racing the sultan after I said "I could have been nice" as the officer was being a douche during the whole encounter and I said "because he being a douche I'm not going to comply with him" (this was me saying I'm not giving you permission to search my car) that's apparently admitting to racing with the sultan and the case got dismissed. if any of that made sense and your answer is that it made no sense that's what I felt like and that's why I think its corrupt but I don't know if the person that dismissed that was corrupt or just didn't understand the law of RS and PC so I didn't report it.

Lastly with IA reports I don't want people to be terminated or suspended I just want a rule change that stops players shooting at people or their vehicle when they don't have a weapon (I don't want them shooting to be that escalation) and cops at unarmed suspects should be treated the same I think that is doable and doesn't effect anyone negatively.

Edited by DrBeelz
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37 minutes ago, DrBeelz said:

Yes I submitted it but it then got denied I then followed it up but they were just repeating what the charge was after I kept showing them the footage of them lying about it but I found myself talking to a broken record as nothing I said changed them just repeating the charge.

Ok here's an example (I'm not going to name any names) I had a high ranking PD officer arrest me under what he said RS to which was completely fabricated and I let him blabber on trying to convince me of something I didn't do and saying he saw me with a sultan that was speeding of which I also had dashcam of the sultan he was on about but it was so far away from me so he lied about me racing it after I let him run his mouth he arrested me I told him not to search my vehicle which he needed PC and he said ill find the PC (that's admitting he didn't have PC and not to his knowledge yet I have dashcam of the lies that he said to disprove what he said so I know he had no real PC or RS) while searching my car he said it doesn't matter as I will find something illegal in there. he then locked me away for no reason because I guess he was mad he didn't find anything I then submitted that to the court and showed all of his comments disproven by the dashcam so he lied about the reason he had RS and him admitting he didn't have RS or PC. the reason my court case got denied was apparently I admitted to racing the sultan after I said "I could have been nice" as the officer was being a douche during the whole encounter and I said "because he being a douche I'm not going to comply with him" (this was me saying I'm not giving you permission to search my car) that's apparently admitting to racing with the sultan and the case got dismissed. if any of that made sense and your answer is that it made no sense that's what I felt like and that's why I think its corrupt but I don't know if the person that dismissed that was corrupt or just didn't understand the law of RS and PC so I didn't report it.

 

I took a look at the court case in question, it was denied at the time because the only charge you were appealing (Failure to comply and Giving false information) you were found to have admitted to failure to comply when you said ''I could've been nice, but he was just an asshole from the start so I'm not gonna comply with him.'' and  ''and the officer failed to understand that if someone is asking something of me that I don't feel like the officer has good intentions and I've done nothing wrong that I had the right to protect my identity'' in the body cam footage you provided. You weren't charged, as far as I can tell, for street racing or any other charge related to the speeding sultan, but for failing to comply with a lawful order during the course of an investigation.

The threshold for reasonable suspicion is less than that of probable cause, if the Officer felt like you were taking part in a crime, were planning to take part in a crime or had taken part in a crime recently, they can legally identify you, whether that is actually true or not, what matters is if an Officer suspects it. Now, of course you can then IA report them under the grounds that they had no reasonable suspicion to ID you and the Officer would then have to explain his side to determine whether RS was present or not, but you automatically lose if you fail comply.

 Police can accuse you of a crime, lying, etc... all of which are IC. However, what they accuse you of and what they charge you with is different. Police can lie to try and gather information, get a confession, gain consent for a search, etc... It is up to you to act out your actions IC'ly, either  argue with them or perhaps exercise your rights and stay quite, even if they claim they are going to arrest you for 30 charges.

 

Any ways, as for your main suggestion with regards to shooting, I believe my initial response still stands, Police are like any other player, report them for NRP or DM if you think what they did was against server rules and and or OOC IA reports. If enough evidence is provided of situations that the community thinks are unrealistic or unacceptable I am definitely willing to change my mind, but as it stands I just haven't seen ''bad shootings'' that border NRP for no reason as the initial point seems to imply, best way to get these things changed is record plenty of evidence and make reports/suggestion threads using that evidence.

Edited by Cyrus Raven
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6 minutes ago, Cyrus Raven said:

whether that is actually true or not, what matters is if an Officer suspects it.

yes that's true but if he makes up the story then he lied about suspecting it so its not RS and none of that should have happened so it should have got accepted it was a clear case but got denied so that's why I don't like IC reports as personally it hasn't worked for me as he made up the suspicion. that's a corrupt cop which I used this to get a court case so it supplied me with RP so that's why I didn't report OOC'ly

Anyway I don't want to make this about that just about the suggestion.

Edited by DrBeelz
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1 minute ago, DrBeelz said:

yes that's true but if he makes up the story then he lied about suspecting it so its no RS as he made up the suspicion that's a corrupt cop which i used to get a court case so it supplied me with RP so that's why I didn't report OOC'ly

Anyway I don't want to make this about that just about the suggestion.

gotcha!

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4 hours ago, DrBeelz said:

My problem with IA reports IC is that 9/10 it ends as a biased review and honestly it isn't enough for cops to take seriously and to be honest is pointless as it never stop cops from doing the same thing over and over again and the only thing that will stop this is a OOC rule

I am personally in charge of the Internal Affairs division and find this quite slanderous and hurtful. I urge you to provide any proof of this bias because I can hand on heart say that there is none. My team work extremely hard upholding standards in character and faction integrity out of character. I strongly suggest you review the statistics of IA and also the notice board for officer punishments to collect actual evidence before making such outlandish comments based on assumptions.

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54 minutes ago, MrSilky said:

I am personally in charge of the Internal Affairs division and find this quite slanderous and hurtful. I urge you to provide any proof of this bias because I can hand on heart say that there is none. My team work extremely hard upholding standards in character and faction integrity out of character. I strongly suggest you review the statistics of IA and also the notice board for officer punishments to collect actual evidence before making such outlandish comments based on assumptions.

I'm sorry that's just how I feel on all my experiences and I've talked to others and they say the same thing and talk about what has happened to them, this isn't to explain a case that happened IC but about a suggestion about a change to a DM rule. In every reply I've tried to go back to what my suggestion is but also answer peoples questions to be honest I was vague with the court case not expecting for someone to find it as it was not to be talked about in detail but as it got brought up which I didn't know someone could do. It was never to slander anyone but as the case was shown I had to explain my side of things to make no confusion.

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5 hours ago, MrSilky said:

I am personally in charge of the Internal Affairs division and find this quite slanderous and hurtful. I urge you to provide any proof of this bias because I can hand on heart say that there is none. My team work extremely hard upholding standards in character and faction integrity out of character. I strongly suggest you review the statistics of IA and also the notice board for officer punishments to collect actual evidence before making such outlandish comments based on assumptions.

I personally had an IA report handled by you that I felt was not handled appropriately. Apart from that, IA has proven fruitful.

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30 minutes ago, AtlasOLimbo said:

I personally had an IA report handled by you that I felt was not handled appropriately. Apart from that, IA has proven fruitful.

Ok as I stated I don't want this to be about talking about how people handled IA IC situations. have you got an opinion on the suggestion as it will help with getting peoples opinions both positive and negative to push the suggested rule change if accepted

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22 minutes ago, DrBeelz said:

Ok as I stated I don't want this to be about talking about how people handled IA IC situations. have you got an opinion on the suggestion as it will help with getting peoples opinions both positive and negative to push the suggested rule change if accepted

Already provided an opinion.

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