DrBeelz

I have read through this post and the main reason I believe and through experience the reason crim RP isn't the best is the amount of gangs that over the course of 30 days somehow gets 20-40 members. and the lack of RP that they are willing to go through as they are forced to for the reason I'm about to talk about. now I know why gangs do this and it is simply because of the economy to have a lab you need close to 2 million and that will get you 48 tables and a place to do it in. Getting that money is hard to do now once you get there it is fine as long as you know how to operate a drug lab however getting to that point is quite difficult. The next best way is through banks and that is why banks are chained so often and are quite boring as crims will use the meta and just use bf400 or shinobis and quite easily escape, maybe 1 will get caught if you are unlucky. I've done quite a few banks and never got caught and that's with a car as I liked the challenge but if you run a 6-man crew each will only get like 25k it's not worth it. and so really you are left with the rest of what a crim can do which is roadworkers, or a high risk - low reward setup e.g., chop shops or running public labs. which unless you are an 8-man crew it is dangerous and 100% always turns into a robbery/shootout as that's all people do. that is low RP and I've never seen a random not be approached and it be none hostile as let's be honest it because everyone is struggling because it is hard to make money. and that's what I'm getting at with my first statement the gangs that have numbers always were hostile and never really engaged with RP because all they wanted was the easy robbery and to reiterate it is because of money as it is hard to come by. also, crims are very limited in creating RP due to how realistic the server is in relation to branching out to the legal side. you want a business to create RP sorry you have a felony record; you want to host a public event sorry police will shut it down because if you have a felony charge that is within a month you won't get PD or SD support and so you really can't publicise it as they will find where its hosted and shut it down. so safe to say giving RP to the community as a crim is impossible unless you don't do crime for a month which is boring as a crim main. I really did try and do business with most gangs in the city but every time they find a way to be hostile and it ends up ruined. while in a gang I saw close to 15 different gangs disband some lasted 1 month some last 3 months and that because all they did was shoot anyone and so reports finally caught up to them as if you engage in PVP every day you are bound to make mistakes, all RP I've seen in gangs is only kept to the gang and no other gangs. I know it happens but not enough but even then, most alliances break down as all it takes for 1 member to shoot the wrong person and then it's a war. Just to point out all my points are what I've seen over a year of playing crim and no gang in particular I am referencing. I have had the pleasure to work with some gangs that have kept a really good RP standard and I respect that, but I got to admit I think the biggest issue is money and the lack of RP that comes with it for certain gangs to make a quick buck. this is why I have moved to be a PD main now as it so much less stressful but as I was a crim main for a long time, I understand both sides and I think hopefully this can limit the amount of LEO vs crim debates that happen because I think a lot of energy is going into tackling the wrong issues not everything LEO's do is perfect and I also support some points against some things said against LEO's but that is not what I think is the biggest issue to fix the current crim issue.

the biggest issue is official gangs are no longer reliant on others to get their imports in and so they have no need to keep alliances, there is official gangs in the city right now that are making actual rp impossible for gangs that are smaller. for example one of the faction gangs I wont say who is stopping us from using a car wash that is not scripted but we use /me's to rp getting all the gang members cars washed, you know something different from being a clapper and guess what every time we go there they say you cant come here leave or die and if we don't leave they kill us. its what crim rp has come to and if you talk to them to understand why, they are a broken record and say the same thing over and over like all they know is ive got more members do as we say or we will have dm rights as you didnt comply its sloppy rp. You try and do something other than start unnecessary beef and kill people and you just get shot down for doing so. Even if you try and meet other gangs instead of going to meetings in good faith they just bring all heavy weapons showing they have no interest in forming deals. this might be different from a big gang to big gang as wars are not going to end well for either side but god forbid you are a smaller gang meeting up with a big gang you are just an easy target to get all their weapons and shave their head just because you have more members and you can boast about it on youtube or in the forums. its bad rp and its what crim rp is right now. you try and run a chop you get raided by big gangs you try and do a bank you get 15k in charges and 5 hours if you dont have 1.3 million guess what you cant have a property. once youve got a property you need 400-500k in tables and that if all you drops dont get comped. like damn ive have a gang try and start beef because they killed our members at labs thats the escalation that some people take as enough to start wars.

Honestly after I joined PD it was so freeing I didn't have to worry about money everything was good, I love chases and it opened up more avenues for me to get creative with RP. With my criminal character I also create good RP with people but it is more difficult to occur as everyone in other gangs always want to stay in their own gangs and not RP with other gangs and very little want to create new RP. and as said gang will attack and rob you for petty reasons and currently im dealing with that exact thing on a daily basis these are just a few reasons I created a PD character as late at night when I just want to chill and have fun I log on to my PD character. I wouldn't go full time PD as I have a gang to manage and its no easy task but as I said PD is my escape.

As I said I'm not against it, just think can it be done and is it an easy change to do? I don't know as I know nothing about coding a server so rewriting the whole faction loadout might be a lot of work but going back to what I said I'm not against it but is there something better that we can improve like spending more time focusing making DOC a better place to be and the reduce time suggestion I made.

This is my perspective from a Crim and PD side as I play both on two different characters. My view on this is that PD aren't really supposed to be beaten. Now for the the longest time I thought that needed to change but the way I see it is that if the LEO's were the same as any other person no-one would fear PD they would just kill them on sight and be done with it. This would be bad as I don't think criminals should run a city and if LEO's were the same as any other person that's what would happen. I know the criminal life is expensive and hard to earn money and having Ak's and body armour is only if you are going to war as its so expensive and crippling if you lose it. I know its not hard to make money in PD it is so fun and the hours fly by thanks to criminals giving us RP and so at the end of the week the money just rolls in so I'm personally not against having LEO's pay for their belonging but I don't think that would solve much. I am yet to be downed as an officer and I only have used a 50. and most of my time I've still got 50% health left so it wouldn't break the bank. but as I said previous what would it solve. As when I'm evading on my crim when I'm facing 3-4+ hours in DOC I'm not thinking at least that cop I killed has to pay for their items. now the biggest thing is this would require a change only the developers can do as you have to get rid of the faction loadout and so it is really worth changing that other than more important things. I don't disagree with your statement I think crim RP helps LEO'S have fun RP and being locked away for 3-4+ hours isn't good. However, if you see something that needs to change just saying it needs to change wont solve anything the best thing to do is have a suggestion on how to make it better. Here is a thread about making suggestions about DOC and I think it is the best place for suggestions. What I would love is have DOC guards have control to reduce times in prison for doing RP jobs around the prison and so it would actually make your time quicker and supply RP to everyone involved.

Would you change your mind on this change if the rules specify you cannot rob LEO's in public or on traffic stops as if they evade to then lure them into a not so public area then backup would already be called if not already and then most likely the crims would be outnumbered, would that change your mind on the topic?

so I've seen this post suggestion has gone massively off topic so I would like to return to it, I now understand that from 6 months of posting this thread that tunnels would not be able to be opened but my point with Air-1 stands I'm not going to state realism as that's not the way to go on a game where the whole point is to have fun as if not what's the point of gaming if your not having fun. Limiting the fuel tank is good for the server and for fun and fairness. as I've since had the pleasure of being in PD I love chases and feel the pressure not to crash, to not lose the driver and if he out drives me I congratulate them but I do feel like I'm cheating when I lose them multiple times but the chase lasts 30-40 minutes as I have constant updates where they are. Let me put this in an analogy, me and my friend are racing the garbage track it is super competitive its down to the second to last corner I take the corner badly but don't worry instead of him gaining distance I get a unfair advantage and get a boost to catch back up and take the last corner better than him and win the race. that's how I feel with Air-1 giving me 1 hr long comms as if it wasn't for that boost(air-1) I wouldn't have caught up and won the race(I would've lost the suspect and he would've got away) I hope that made sense and what are your thoughts on that, the main part of this post is to limit the fuel tank for better tactics for LEO'S and fun for both sides. LEO's will still be powerful as they should be in the server but having this change will reward good driving and fair play for all.

+1 As a person with both a crim and cop character I think this would be a good idea, I get that concerns arise with cops would be able to be robbed and that they might get hunted but rules are already implement that would stop that so I'm not worried about that as stated the current rules do specify that LEO'S or people cant be robbed in public places even if taken to an alleyway as Melody Frey said the risk would not be worth it Another thing I agree on is that there could even be extreme IC punishments for people in possession of LEO firearms/body armour and I support this as it would make people cautious with the risk of carrying a technically free AR or shotgun and will make a risk to reward in using the firepower to get a upper hand in the consequence of being caught and going in for serious time. it would make people think more about their actions. my one question is would having body armour and AR's robbable from LEO's take away from imported items and decrease the feature just a thought.

+1

As you can see hitting money trucks is something that is already implemented into the game since it launched, I remember when I first bought the game on release date I would love to see money trucks and as it is already implemented into the game I think this is do-able. there's 2 ways I see how this could work in ECRP one you have a simple copy and paste from the already implemented design having NPC'S do the job with a decent payout as it will alert the law enforcement to the location so it wont be easy or not be too hard or this be a specialist job for PD and SD where to make it fair there only be a set number of law enforcement that can provide backup initially and if an attack happens then more can be provided. I think because this option is high risk as you have going up against PD or SD the payout should be the same as banks due to the nature as likely the Law enforcement having all the armour and weapons to ensure the money gets to its destination safely. if you agree or disagree just reply with -1 or +1 and and a brief reason to why.

Ok as I stated I don't want this to be about talking about how people handled IA IC situations. have you got an opinion on the suggestion as it will help with getting peoples opinions both positive and negative to push the suggested rule change if accepted

I'm sorry that's just how I feel on all my experiences and I've talked to others and they say the same thing and talk about what has happened to them, this isn't to explain a case that happened IC but about a suggestion about a change to a DM rule. In every reply I've tried to go back to what my suggestion is but also answer peoples questions to be honest I was vague with the court case not expecting for someone to find it as it was not to be talked about in detail but as it got brought up which I didn't know someone could do. It was never to slander anyone but as the case was shown I had to explain my side of things to make no confusion.

yes that's true but if he makes up the story then he lied about suspecting it so its not RS and none of that should have happened so it should have got accepted it was a clear case but got denied so that's why I don't like IC reports as personally it hasn't worked for me as he made up the suspicion. that's a corrupt cop which I used this to get a court case so it supplied me with RP so that's why I didn't report OOC'ly Anyway I don't want to make this about that just about the suggestion.