Add "AFK Walking in a Circle" to Rules/Subrule

[agentxyz2]

After Receiving some feedback on my original post and experiencing this first hand, I have come up with a simple suggestion for a rule addition. 

I suggest that the Eclipse team add AFK walking in a circle or Circumventing AFK timer through OOC forces as a Rule or Subrule. (To deter opportunists and clarify the gravity of the offence)

Having survived the ban and appeal process and seen others banned in jail, there is nothing that can be done for myself, but for future new players I believe it would be helpful in deterring this behavior. Human nature dictates that unless explicitly told not to do something there will be people who seize opportunity. For example if the rules did not state Hacking/Cheating was against the rules, inevitably there would be people who did it for the simple fact that it isn't against the rules and its an opportunity. 

[agentxyz2]

As this is a simple suggestion and not a debate, please keep responses simple along the lines of +1 or -1 pertaining to if this rule/subrule should be added to the Server Rules. If you have major concerns please PM me. 

[Linden]

A suggestion is something to BE debated, not just a poll.

A system exists to ensure that players are not AFK, attempting to bypass that system is clearly an exploit which is frowned upon in any game and community. If you have some something setup to ensure you will walk around in a circle for hours you are exploiting which is a server offence.

"Players must not have mods, trainers or any kind of software installed that gives any advantage." You could also classify the behaviour as non-rp.

 

The advantage of abusing the AFK timer is gaining government cheques and increasing your experience which is often a requirement for applications such as joining a faction or applying for server staff.

[ThePro]

41 minutes ago, Linden said:

A suggestion is something to BE debated, not just a poll.

A system exists to ensure that players are not AFK, attempting to bypass that system is clearly an exploit which is frowned upon in any game and community. If you have some something setup to ensure you will walk around in a circle for hours you are exploiting which is a server offence.

"Players must not have mods, trainers or any kind of software installed that gives any advantage." You could also classify the behaviour as non-rp.

 

The advantage of abusing the AFK timer is gaining government cheques and increasing your experience which is often a requirement for applications such as joining a faction or applying for server staff.

Exactly.

[agentxyz2]

37 minutes ago, Linden said:

A suggestion is something to BE debated, not just a poll.

A system exists to ensure that players are not AFK, attempting to bypass that system is clearly an exploit which is frowned upon in any game and community. If you have some something setup to ensure you will walk around in a circle for hours you are exploiting which is a server offence.

"Players must not have mods, trainers or any kind of software installed that gives any advantage." You could also classify the behaviour as non-rp.

 

The advantage of abusing the AFK timer is gaining government cheques and increasing your experience which is often a requirement for applications such as joining a faction or applying for server staff.

I agree abusing the afk timer provides many benefits to the player, but the majority of what you conveyed above is your interpretation of the rules and not what they explicitly state. This is especially apparent in the fact that admins ban players specifically for walking afk and not any of the rules 1-15. Majority of reports/bans are held strictly to the rules, but this offence is unclear and unstated.

[Linden]

 

20 minutes ago, agentxyz2 said:

Hey Man I saw your response, I just had a quick counter point. Fair point on the suggestion needing to be debated. However, in regards to classifying "walking in circle afk" I don't think you're correct. First off: Do you think the rule should be added, yes or no? Cause you never actually gave a clear answer whether the rule should be added or not. 

At the moment people are banned for "Walking in circle afk"/afk walking etc, They aren't banned under any of the Rules 1-15. The reason being is because it is an unclear stretch to place it under any of the rules

"Players must not have mods, trainers or any kind of software installed that gives any advantage." You could also classify the behaviour as non-rp.

A player can use rubber band and a controller which was the case in my situation. And in regards to RP, one can RP exercising in a circle jogging it's again a stretch to place in under non-rp. Also exploit is by definition "a software tool designed to take advantage of a flaw in a computer system". The rules state nothing about bypassing server afk systems. It is again unclear which was the point of my suggestion. 

Sure, add in a rule regarding all sorts of scenarios which fall under existing rules. People are prone to interpreting rules in a way that is beneficial for them, so it is important to ensure that they cannot claim they did not know. I doubt that you feel what you did was acceptable but you are trying to justify it.

What I quoted as an example of exploiting is one that is written in the rules, but the overall rule is about exploiting thus looking at the various definitions of exploiting will provide you with the exact reason for your punishment.

"A known way to compromise a program to get it to do something the author didn’t intend."
"A program or system designed to take advantage of a particular error or security vulnerability in computers or networks."
"To employ to the greatest possible advantage."

 

Technically speaking, adding a rubber band to a controller could be defined as a modification as you are changing the functionality of the device. Regardless I believe most people would agree that walking in circles or into a wall or some other aimless action like that for the purpose of farming pay cheques is not fair play or roleplay. In the end I am of the belief that the admin team responded appropriately in this situation and to be frank they are well within their rights to interpret the rules to ensure nobody takes advantage of the server mechanics in a way that is dishonest and outside the intended use set by the developers.

 

tldr; Add in examples and scenarios where a rule would apply, but just because somebodies interpretation of the rules makes their actions acceptable does not mean it is within the intended purposes the staff team envisioned. Staff have the right to punish as they see appropriate and in the off-chance they start punishing people unfairly then it will be dealt with by their superiors.

[Randul]

The server rules from my belief need to be broad in this regard, if you are too specific then players will use the excuse of its not written exactly in the rules. Hence why umbrella rules such as no exploits / non rp exist so players can still be held accountable as long as they fall within that range without needing to state every single offence that are covered under those headings. 

Adding more detail to the rulebook yes removes some room for interpretation however it also allows players to search for those gaps and exploit it. 

I've played on servers that have extreme rule books (30+ pages) which was far too difficult to enforce and a server rule that all they had listed was nonrp as the singular rule. Personally I favoured the latter, we found players were there to roleplay instead of game the system with less rules. 

[gohena]

This is kinda known rule that's been in all gta rp servers for ages for the most part, there is a script that auto kicks afkers already, if caught exploiting it there will be consequences for example making yourself walk in circles

[Loafism]

8 hours ago, agentxyz2 said:

but this offence is unclear

I don't see how it is unclear, if you were allowed to AFK to farm paychecks there wouldn't be an auto kick for it.

 

11 hours ago, agentxyz2 said:

Human nature dictates that unless explicitly told not to do something there will be people who seize opportunity. For example if the rules did not state Hacking/Cheating was against the rules, inevitably there would be people who did it for the simple fact that it isn't against the rules and its an opportunity. 

And I also don't see why we should cater to the people who are going to "seize opportunity" to do something which to any reasonable person would be clearly wrong. I'd rather let them try to "seize the opportunity" so they can be banned, as the server would be better off without those people who are going to push things to the limit just because it's not on the rules when common sense would tell you it shouldn't be done.

[agentxyz2]

3 hours ago, Dominic Gru said:

+1

I appreciate the simplicity. Your response is the only one so far that has had a + or -1. Its a very simple suggestion, add a line or two of text to the rules that would deter bad behavior, I only see this as a net positive but others think otherwise it seems. 

"I would not give a fig for the simplicity this side of complexity, but I would give my life for the simplicity on the other side of complexity"  - Oliver Wendell Holmes

[Loafism]

2 hours ago, agentxyz2 said:

I appreciate the simplicity. Your response is the only one so far that has had a + or -1.

 

Yes the guy who is spamming +1 to get that post count really was a good person to thank, really supports your idea of only +/-1.

 

Yes it's a simple thing but it's just like the "do not lick" on the tin can lids. It's something that any reasonable person should know and if they do it it's their own stupidity.

[Linden]

8 minutes ago, Loafism said:

Yes it's a simple thing but it's just like the "do not lick" on the tin can lids.

i like the way the blood tastes in my mouth

[agentxyz2]

We get it, you guys have made your side clear, if you want to keep chatting, take it to the version of this post that was moved to discussion. I'd like to get as many fresh opinions as possible. 

[Chunder]

SUGGESTION DENIED

Thank you for your patience while this suggestion was being reviewed/researched.

After reviewing/researching this suggestion, we have decided to deny it for the following reason(s): 

• This has been added to a rule - "Server scripts must not be exploited in any way, e.g. circumventing AFK timer."

This decision is final. Unless instructed to, do not post another suggestion pertaining to this topic. You will still be able to submit other suggestions on the forums.

Regards,

Chunder