Define Ruleplay in the Rules

[Msato]

Currently one of the primary issues that many face is "Ruleplay" - This being when someone utilises their OOC knowledge of the rules to their characters advantage.

An example: Player A is driving 80km/h through the city whilst they know they're being chased by a rival gang.

 

As it stands currently, this only falls under Mixing, and in rare cases NRP. I believe it would be highly beneficial to have this as it's own separate rule type.

I.e Ruleplay #1, #2, #3

This would allow it to be specifically enforced across the large number of scenarios we currently witness this occur & assist deter people from doing so.

 

[Germane]

+1 I think this would be a great idea in that fact that as of now its just considered poor rp. Many players that arent apart of any factions dont care because for them, they barley get a slap on the wrist and they get to keep their stuff because they are using their OOC knowledge as an advantage to win the situation. Which not only is it that play to win mindset, they would rather sit at bank for however long they need, just to keep their things. 

[KCAJ]

+1, rule playing is abused way too much 

[Donovan]

+1 been an issue for a long time, specially ncz abuse

[MVGGreg]

+1 too many situations are not being solved IC'ly right now and always end up going into /b and reports due to this.

[MPheonix]

i don’t see how adding ruleplay as a rule to combat a problem caused by rules would make things better 

[Msato]

8 minutes ago, MPheonix said:

i don’t see how adding ruleplay as a rule to combat a problem caused by rules would make things better 

The problem is not caused by the rules, it's caused by how individuals play them to their advatnage.

[Antho]

+1 , people abuse this so much honestly ruins the RP

[Rekamon]

+1 Crim vs Crim RP is severely ruined due to criminals ruleplaying.

[Dylan Ortiz]

+1

[cedridge]

We don't need another rule regulating other rules, we need these rules to be realistic and how the community actually wants them instead of unrealistic rules that no one likes and get ruleplayed in every situation. Adding another rule regarding other rules would just introduce more grey areas and ironically, more ruleplay, instead I suggest the rules that get ruleplayed most, get reworked to the point where ruleplay is almost impossible, for example, removal of the player theft rule between criminals as it simply just floods the chat with /b reported every time u rob anyone and causes staleness of the crim life as well as wasting staff and player time on silly reports over .50cals. Another example would be the demands (allow us to give them from cars again and at a decent speed), which would also prevent ruleplay of the player theft rule by allowing us to somewhat choose the location of where the fight will occur instead of waiting for the driver to stall with a possibility of it being a highly populated area.

[MPheonix]

15 hours ago, CallumMontie said:

The problem is not caused by the rules, it's caused by how individuals play them to their advatnage.

more like the vast majority of the server. in my time in eclipse i don’t think ive ever been in an rp situation that hasn’t resorted to /b the moment someone is at a disadvantage. mostly the older more experienced eclipse players I’ve found have a habit of doing this, wouldn’t be surprised if it’s encouraged to be honest 
 

the problem is caused by the rules, which are put in place to make for a better RP experience on eclipse, but they make it worse. by having such rules it means the rules are always at the front of most people’s minds, rather than RP or the thoughts of their character. 

only place I’ve even heard the words ruleplay is eclipse. 

[Donovan]

12 hours ago, cedridge said:

We don't need another rule regulating other rules, we need these rules to be realistic and how the community actually wants them instead of unrealistic rules that no one likes and get ruleplayed in every situation. Adding another rule regarding other rules would just introduce more grey areas and ironically, more ruleplay, instead I suggest the rules that get ruleplayed most, get reworked to the point where ruleplay is almost impossible, for example, removal of the player theft rule between criminals as it simply just floods the chat with /b reported every time u rob anyone and causes staleness of the crim life as well as wasting staff and player time on silly reports over .50cals. Another example would be the demands (allow us to give them from cars again and at a decent speed), which would also prevent ruleplay of the player theft rule by allowing us to somewhat choose the location of where the fight will occur instead of waiting for the driver to stall with a possibility of it being a highly populated area.

You do not understand where are we coming from, the point of the matter are not specific rules, but the mindset and mentality of people basing their IC actions on their OOC Knowledge of the rules, instead of following the RP the way it is already going in... Take a look at the problem going on for years regarding gangs shit talking other gangs/people at bank. You are safe because you are in under an NCZ, you are not really doing anything illegal so RPly u got rights to do it, but people abuse the fact that they know other gangs cannot touch them there to trash talk them sometimes even for hours. It is just one of the many examples where peoples ingame actions are based on their OOC knowledge of the rules and their abuse...

[cedridge]

1 hour ago, Donovan said:

You do not understand where are we coming from, the point of the matter are not specific rules, but the mindset and mentality of people basing their IC actions on their OOC Knowledge of the rules, instead of following the RP the way it is already going in... Take a look at the problem going on for years regarding gangs shit talking other gangs/people at bank. You are safe because you are in under an NCZ, you are not really doing anything illegal so RPly u got rights to do it, but people abuse the fact that they know other gangs cannot touch them there to trash talk them sometimes even for hours. It is just one of the many examples where peoples ingame actions are based on their OOC knowledge of the rules and their abuse...

Yeah, i do understand but where does that stem from, the rules that makes them feel invincible, if the rules were actually how most of us would want them then I don't really see how they would be ruleplayed, like I said another rule would add even more ruleplay and reports which makes it kind of pointless, easier solution would be to actually rework the rules to the community's liking.

[MPheonix]

2 hours ago, Donovan said:

You do not understand where are we coming from, the point of the matter are not specific rules, but the mindset and mentality of people basing their IC actions on their OOC Knowledge of the rules, instead of following the RP the way it is already going in... Take a look at the problem going on for years regarding gangs shit talking other gangs/people at bank. You are safe because you are in under an NCZ, you are not really doing anything illegal so RPly u got rights to do it, but people abuse the fact that they know other gangs cannot touch them there to trash talk them sometimes even for hours. It is just one of the many examples where peoples ingame actions are based on their OOC knowledge of the rules and their abuse...

this is just a problem of having OOC rules that have such a big impact on IC scenarios. it’s literally not possible to remain in-character n always base IC actions entirely on IC knowledge, without taking OOC knowledge of rules etc into account as well.

you say it’s been a problem for years but it’ll just continue to be a problem with more rules being added. people will always break rules, and people will always try to play the rules to their benefit. the more rules there are, and the less-straightforward they get, the more it’ll happen 

reworking the current rules would be the better solution

Edited July 11, 2020 by MPheonix

[freshprinceIE]

One of the things I see and find stupid is when 10 gang cars are following a guy for ages, he radios allies who then set an ambush and open fire on the 10 cars.

They (the chasers, who plan to rob/kill the person) seem to expect that you would stop the cars and try to give demands, even though they were clearly following your ally...

I think the rules should be changed to clarify that this is allowed or not (some admins have said it is, some had said it isn't).

[Xoza]

'Rule'playing.

Purposefully using, manipulating or interpreting rules or rulings falsely or outside of its intention, in an unrealistic or unintended way to that does not constitute quality or realistic RP standards.

____________

Purposeful misinterpretation to benefit one self in RP can additionally be seen as metagaming and other actions can be seen as powergaming, depending on the situation. Thus I think this best falls under NonRP as it covers a few variations.

Edited September 3, 2020 by Xoza

[freshprinceIE]

+1

[MrJangoon]

ruleplaying is very uncommon and barely has any effect these days when it comes to genuine rp situations.

-1

and at times ruleplaying is necessary to stop players from powergaming and otherwise

[Jaquan Smith]

 

ruleplaying is very uncommon and barely has any effect these days when it comes to genuine rp situations.

-1

and at times ruleplaying is necessary to stop players from powergaming and otherwise

You're probably not playing as a criminal so you don't know does it work. Ruleplaying still affects RP scenarios, and it is common 

[MrJangoon]

 

You're probably not playing as a criminal so you don't know does it work. Ruleplaying still affects RP scenarios, and it is common 

I do rp as a criminal and at times i have found myself unintentionally powergaming. I would much rather get ruleplayed into ic consequences than get banned. [i am kind of paranoid because i appealed my ban and now if i get 1 stain on my thing im dead]

[CarryOut]

I think ruleplaying is a huge issue still. 
I was sitting at LSC a few days ago, and a gang was chasing one member of a rival gang. This member of the rival gang comes to LSC and parks up then seems to go AFK. (Not sure if he actually did or not)
The member of this gang only went to the location because he knows it would have been against the robbery rules to get robbed at LSC, whereas before the rule was implemented, people would never run to LSC for protection. (Unless they were goin to shoot at LSC)
There are several instances where people try to rob someone and are immediately met with "You can't rob me here it's too public."
I haven't done a lot of legal RP since the rule was introduced, but I see it a lot on the crim/civ side.

[CarryOut]

Huge +1
I had kind of explained why I agreed under CallumMontie's suggestion in regards to this.

[kris giggs]

It is an issue at large, the rules are very simplified in a way that abusing them is relatively easy, I do not prefer using the term vague but some rules do have apparent loopholes and roleplay in general is suffering because of this. Hopefully the staff team can clear this up and define ruleplay as a rule breach and issue clear and strict punishments.

+1

[Xoza]

 

Huge +1
I had kind of explained why I agreed under CallumMontie's suggestion in regards to this.

Yikes, I didn't even see his suggestion about it. I may have read it once, but must have misread it as 'roleplaying'..