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The Ruined State of Criminal RP

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3 hours ago, GWXCORE said:

These people talking trash, they don't remember when Azteca's were literally 12 people or something, fighting all of council, plus vory, plus wca, plus rooks, always fighting someone, for what, 6 months? Now they are council. And people want to dog them like they never earned shit.

For us we never clerarly fought council as council only had hit us i guess yall can say that we hada hard time but yall saying that we were geting hit by council that isnt true as i was in the gang from early setemper when still patron and raul were the leaders of the organization and knowing now that yall want somone to survive a 120 man zerg is posible is laughable at most times we as nla got hit by 50-60 people unconsistently when the war with wca started it was allways even numbers not saying we havent fought a even long battle but your text seems like your shining them ass they are the best all do theres alot of negative things to say about the group oocly and icly and yall shining them out to make them prety so they get official .

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7 hours ago, Arnis said:

For us we never clerarly fought council as council only had hit us i guess yall can say that we hada hard time but yall saying that we were geting hit by council that isnt true as i was in the gang from early setemper when still patron and raul were the leaders of the organization and knowing now that yall want somone to survive a 120 man zerg is posible is laughable at most times we as nla got hit by 50-60 people unconsistently when the war with wca started it was allways even numbers not saying we havent fought a even long battle but your text seems like your shining them ass they are the best all do theres alot of negative things to say about the group oocly and icly and yall shining them out to make them prety so they get official .

?

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Sorry, I'm kind of new here. Couldn't you get around the cap by just using established money and connections (soft power) to reinforce the influence that would have otherwise come from more guys and guns (hard power)? Then using the soft power, just use smaller gangs as proxies for your larger gang? For example, if the Zetas can't recruit more people, instead they find a smaller gang--maybe its 10-15 people in a particular timezone--and use them as muscle. The Zetas will let the smaller gang operate unmolested, and the smaller gang will fight alongside the Zetas. Sure, you have the potential of the smaller gang eventually competing, but you keep them in check and throttle their recruitment through your influence. That way you have several small gangs representing medium gangs representing larger gangs: it creates a social hierarchy of who matters and who is who, and more vertical moves besides who calls the shots on "the council". It also offers more of a stepping-stone adventure for the LSPD when they try to take down criminal enterprises since they will have to obtain information from multiple gangs to really make it matter. If you want to get more complex, larger gangs can take territory they consider theirs and apply a feudal system: award portions of their lands as fiefs to the gangs that have gained enough size to hold it. This allows you to show a presence and gangs to interact with people through extortion and racketeering rather than just plain-jane robbery.

To me, it seems like there are plenty of opportunities, but I also am not in a gang and haven't had the opportunity to join one. If there is any issue it is that the measures pointed out exhibit a trend of negative reinforcement. Essentially, the server administration is punishing what it deems bad behavior, but it does not seem to have put as many positive reinforcements in order to properly elicit that behavior. If they want people to start their own gangs rather than joining existing large ones, they should make it easier to start your own, not just make it harder to join another. Again, I haven't been here for long so I can't speak to whether they have done that and I am just ignorant of it. Just my observations as a new player.

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5 hours ago, MrUntouchable215 said:

Not going to lie, that's actually really well said. I will keep that input in mind. 

Appreciate it! Just seems like when people say there aren't opportunities to RP anymore, you just take the adversity as its own opportunity.

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@sasanmohamade you are complaining about stuff that you have legit 0 knowledge about, you don't know what's going on ICly, nor OOCly that what's the reason which drags the council to war with a gang.
I'm kinda curios why did you think that the "cap limit" will prevent you from getting robbed at the chop shops, drug labs, etc? There always will be someone to rob you or shave your head, does not matter what's the color, people always do whatever they want. "destroying chop shops" they are trying to be on the top for years, why you think you have to become the best in few weeks by talking shit with them?

On 5/28/2020 at 2:30 PM, sasanmohamade said:

yes but robbing some one Belong drug labs not in middle  of the street or drop of point Crime RP have this server for 2 YEARS and server was unplayable for other players think getting robb buy same guy  3 time  in butcher in 1 hours and you cant do any thing about it because he log in in game only for destroying other players Experience in game  

did you check mining or other oil job every one is happy whit new rules and enjoy playing 

AFAIK the robbery rule for criminals had a change and made it so better for them. btw they were not talking about not being able to rob civilians, the problem was some gangs used to go in speed limit in the city, staying 24/7 at parking lot, or baiting reports. And I say it again, don't complain about things that we both know you have 0 knowledge about. 
 

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I will just repeat what I've been saying for past 1-2 years, crim rp is way too scripted ( as in predictable, repetitive etc. ) and not nearly enough dynamic and impulsive/natural..

Almost 90% of criminal interactions with an ENEMY gang/group are predictable, with the rules limiting what u can and cant do without consent or some other reasoning behind it, every situation ends up in the receiving end already knowing all 2-3 possible outcomes and just bases his gameplay off that knowledge. He knows that he cant be shot if he puts hands up, he knows he cant be kidnapped, he knows he cant do this or that, so whatever he does or says or the people engaging the roleplay doesn't matter, because the roleplay has already been presented to them via restrictions that are in place, which leads to situations where during robberies people put their hands up, talk shit, act disrespectful etc. usually followed by /b I got my hands up/ I am complying you cannot do anything besides take my stuff etc. 


Which is the reason why the criminals here have mostly become businessman with a .50 or a heavy on them, because whats the point of watching a movie if you know what will happen already ? 🙂

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Sitting in Bayview for 70 hours a week or so, because of pretty much your whole statement. Really sums it up.

25 minutes ago, Donovan said:

Which is the reason why the criminals here have mostly become businessman with a .50 or a heavy on them, because whats the point of watching a movie if you know what will happen already ? 🙂

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A few of the initial mention topics have recently been revised and received updates, however "Criminal Roleplay" is still in a very poor state.
 

  • The player theft rule was adjusted to accommodate criminal rivalries which was a positive change, however it still leaves enough vagueness that it allows for evident Ruleplay and report "baiting".
     
  • The "40 Member cap" has absolutely ruined certain time zones for most gangs, e.g. when we once has 5/6 people on at 12pm UTC we have now had to drop this timezone entirely. This does not create a dynamic nor good environment for RP - instead it created a "priority timezone" where people will only log in to play together. RP should not be capped like this.
     
  • Overall the current ruleset directed towards criminals is vastly punishing and enforces a set "play style" limiting creativity in both RP and player interactions. Rules should be made to be enforced when breaches, not fully limit entire sections of RP, essentially scaring a player base away from carrying out certain actions.


TLDR: The primary problem with criminal RP is the rules, and how they're forcing people to RP in a set procedure. This needs to be changed, otherwise this area of RP will heavily continue to diminish and dwindle away.

Edited by CallumMontie
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The gang size update: In reality gangs always overpower cops so the argument of balancing things done by admins in itself is non roleplay and pretty harmful to the server. Gangs have always outnumbered cops, as cops have restricted manpower and funding. However, that's when cops usually operate undercover and with other organisations, banding together to gain intelligence to slow down operations, big or small in regards to gangs. I have never seen a server self sabotage its own playerbase like this as they parade they are friendly to 'new gangs', new players and opportunity. I think they had the right idea so the top 3 gangs don't have everyone in it and more people go to different gangs, but, who are admins to dictate this rather than the roleplay of individuals?

Edited by LuchaLeii
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I'm not sure that hashtags and insults is the right way to go on this, so let's not go assigning blame on people.

Now that being said, I did think perhaps losing the Zetas might shake things up a little bit, but I don't know if I see the same kind of presence from the newer factions than the older factions. I would love to see that change.

That being said, hopefully when Osvaldon drops the upcoming update, people visiting and posting on this thread will have more of a positive outlook!

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