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waffels852

Sasha_vasilyev (7.2.4 - 7.3 - 7.4 - 7.1)

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Player(s) being reported: Sasha Vasilyev @Lunaa,
Date of rule breach: 11/4/2018
Time of rule breach: 8:40 EST

Your characters name: Jordan Baxtor
Other players involved: Nicholas Harm, Helene Dubois, Miles townsend, Cynthia Shelby, might be a few more possibly.

Specific rule broken:
" Fear roleplay is the concept of roleplaying fear for your character’s life in situations where your safety is in immediate
danger when the attacker is in a position to quickly end your life at will. This can come in a form of having a weapon
aimed at your character’s head at close range, where reaching for your own weapon would result in you being killed
instantly, or where your life is in direct danger and any attempt to resist would result in your immediate death. A player must allow their victim enough time to comply with the demands and warn the victim more than one time, if
the victim is too slow to respond or react to the demands. Vehicle deathmatch is identical to deathmatch, however, the rule explains how vehicles should not be used as weapons. Kill on sight (KoS) is the act of killing a player with no engagement in roleplay. "

How did the player break the rule?: We were on an investigation of a scene where we had heard from an x-ray unit that there was multiple people up at a drug lab, we went to investigate, and we had lost track of them during a pursuit, after we had called it off and went back down to the road, los zetas were blocking the road and had hopped out and immediately killed myself (Jordan Baxtor) when they started opening fire I had called tac-1 and it had been intiated, after others responded they were immediately gunned down with no chance for any rp, nor any chance to respond to demands or anything, after units started arriving on scene they immediately started killing every single unit. They gave us no chance to rp no chance to talk or anything, it was pure rdm, they're not here for RP they're here to do whatever they want. As police we should have a active presence on scenes, instead we have to deal with people who shoot us at first sight for aboslutely no reason, they had no KOS on any of us and instead decided to immediately shoot for no reason.

Evidence of rule breach: (this is after the main scene, but can still see parts of the after math, multiple people will say the exact same thing as Sasha Vasilyev killed about 6 cops within 2 minutes.) https://plays.tv/video/5bdfa157028dd11403/yeah-right

Edited by waffels852
Edited to remove a name from the players being reported, he was inside the vehicle the entire time.
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Helene Dubois here, vouching for this.

When I arrived on scene to the TAC 1 situation and exited my vehicle I was immediately rammed by another vehicle and then one shot finished me off.

EDIT: All three people have been notified of this report.

Edited by Denise C
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13 minutes ago, Denise C said:

Helene Dubois here, vouching for this.

When I arrived on scene to the TAC 1 situation and exited my vehicle I was immediately rammed by another vehicle and then one shot finished me off.

EDIT: All three people have been notified of this report.

The same thing happened to me as well (Miles Townsend here), the ram didn't kill me but I was killed after by one of the perps.

Edited by xxStallingCoinxx

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Like I can almost bet everyone in pd has had this exact same type of situation and it's tiring after awhile, we want the best rp possible, not to be gunned down on a daily basis with no chance for an actual rp scenario to even happen.

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I don't get it why you have even made a report.

You are asking for better role play? 
Just letting you know the facts that can be clearly seen

1. you are at drug lab, you are a cop, you are driving police car, and you saw a gang and you are entering without backup, what do you think would happen in real life if cops showed up when there would be gangsters making drugs and had a heavy guns with them? they would give you flowers and hugs?

2. you were just driving around and calling for backup and if backup would have came there would be only two scenarios 
a) they would be dead
b) they would be arrested

So I am really interested now, what would be your suggestion for this situation so you could call a good role play? what they should have done? warned you until you waited for backup and then arrested them or shot them down? Would you consider that a good roleplay? 

Edited by ViktorR
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Players who are NOT INVOLVED in the report are not allowed to respond unless sharing necessary or pertinent concrete evidence ("I can confirm." or "That's what happened." is not acceptable). If you comment on a report you're not involved in you may be warned by a forum moderator.

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I don’t agree with what Victor said. When I was pulling away from the lab after an off-road pursuit, I passed the black vehicle first, then Jordan Baxtor went to pass it a few moments later. They were coming into the drug lab, not going away from it, so I’m struggling to understand how we rolled up on “gangsters making drugs who have heavy weapons.”

 

I went around the contender (I believe it was) with three occupants in it and had no issues. I believe Victor is implying that the reason they killed Jordan was because he called for backup. If that’s the case, then that’s an admittance of guilt, as Jordan didn’t call for backup. All he radioed in was that there was a black contender approaching the drug lab, which is worth reporting as we just had a pursuit in the area. He only radioed in for backup after he was under fire, which is when he obviously reported shots fired.

 

That said, I have been told time and time again that the only reason you can KOS police for being police is if they’re arresting you or if you’re witnessing them arrest your friend or ally firsthand. Neither of these criteria were met and they had no indication that we were going to arrest them. Victor’s post shows that he is trying to justify the RDM by some other means (“we pulled up on a drug lab, they’re heavily armed, they’re gangsters, what did we expect,” etc.), none of which do this rulebreak justice from my understanding of the rules, especially since many of the points he made are either inconsistent or false.

Edited by Denise C
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@Denise C Got evidence? Screenshots... Videos.. I asked you & your cadet buddy before but got no answer. Again, still waiting for an admin to respond. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

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I'm not really understanding what I need evidence for. If you're saying that your vehicle was COMING OUT of the drug lab, not going INTO it, which is the only claim I've really made in my post, then you're just flat out lying. That's your prerogative and I'm sure the responding administrator will see through it because it's a sort of lackluster lie that doesn't really get anyone anywhere. I passed you guys in my cruiser with the cadet, who is also a witness, and then Jordan Baxtor came up afterwards, after us, after we had passed you on our way OUT of the vicinity of the drug lab, which is when you and your companions were ENTERING it--and you weren't even entering it. You were on the road where our cruisers were in that video heading towards it. Again, I don't know what you're trying to contest by asking me for evidence when I've only made one claim against your friend saying that you guys are "heavy armed gangsters making drugs".

And yes, I did not answer you because I have no interest in entertaining a Discord private message with you. I think I'm more than allowed to do that without any repercussions, and I think it's an administrator's job to request evidence, not yours.

 

Either way, for the responding administrator, if I had screenshots or recordings of the event, they would have been posted in my initial response, and the people who not only RDMed but vehicle rammed us would be punished accordingly. Unfortunately I have neither, apologies for that. x

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On 11/6/2018 at 4:21 PM, Denise C said:

I don’t agree with what Victor said. When I was pulling away from the lab after an off-road pursuit, I passed the black vehicle first, then Jordan Baxtor went to pass it a few moments later. They were coming into the drug lab, not going away from it, so I’m struggling to understand how we rolled up on “gangsters making drugs who have heavy weapons.”

 

I went around the contender (I believe it was) with three occupants in it and had no issues. I believe Victor is implying that the reason they killed Jordan was because he called for backup. If that’s the case, then that’s an admittance of guilt, as Jordan didn’t call for backup. All he radioed in was that there was a black contender approaching the drug lab, which is worth reporting as we just had a pursuit in the area. He only radioed in for backup after he was under fire, which is when he obviously reported shots fired.

 

That said, I have been told time and time again that the only reason you can KOS police for being police is if they’re arresting you or if you’re witnessing them arrest your friend or ally firsthand. Neither of these criteria were met and they had no indication that we were going to arrest them. Victor’s post shows that he is trying to justify the RDM by some other means (“we pulled up on a drug lab, they’re heavily armed, they’re gangsters, what did we expect,” etc.), none of which do this rulebreak justice from my understanding of the rules, especially since many of the points he made are either inconsistent or false.

Well I was talking about what I have seen in evidence + from my own experience. As clearly you didn't share any evidence about the situation you described in your post I don't know if it is false or not. ALSO Officers are asking for a better role play from us, but as it comes to Officers, they don't care, I am not talking about you in specific. 

One of the examples what I am talking about : https://streamable.com/2ufj8 - why police started shooting at man, the guy didn't even took his gun out. I can accept the fact why they started shooting at the car to disable it, but at guy who was already far away and on bike? well I can see only one goal there, they just tried to kill him. Is that a good role play? 

Also I have some more videos of my own, but I don't want to start report "war" with police, because it takes a lot of time and I don't have time for it.

Even for example, yesterday we were having a meeting with our gang and police out of nowhere showed with the swat team, they came to private territory without warrant or anything (perfect role play) , just walked around with heavy guns and went off because we didn't do anything wrong. But how they knew that we were there, for what reason all swat team came, we didn't get any explanations, so this is role play scenario which you call a good one ? 

Another good example, when Officers have ultra vision which helps them see through the walls (I mean using third person view), when they can spot your heavyguns from 1 mile, when you are sitting in the car, or even when you are behind the wall which would be not possible if there would be only first person view. But noo, everything is good, Officers are doing the best role play, only criminals needs to improve . 

About @waffels852 respond - well you are one of the staff members, also you are at PD, so I am asking what role play you expected and what role play you would consider a good one? I think i have the right to ask this kind of questions, especially when you are both PD and one of the staff members. To be honest, I also don't understand "Players who are NOT INVOLVED in the report are not allowed to respond "  sentence, no explanations only warnings again. I am just trying to learn and this report topic seemed just fine place to ask, because as i mentioned before, you are one of the staff members and also an Officer and if i will get warned just because I am trying to learn and understand, well let it be. 

P.S I don't want to conflict with anyone, it just seems not fair when officers has much more power IC and OCC that a regular civilian. 

Edited by ViktorR

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Wait is Victor even one of the people being reported or involved in the situation? This isn’t a rant page or a topic to complain about PD...it’s meant to address a specific instance of rulebreak, and I’m pretty a rule says that you can’t post on reports you aren’t directly involved in. If I would’ve known he wasn’t involved I wouldn’t have typed all that stuff out to begin with lol, would have just ignored his comment.

Edited by Denise C

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If you have evidence around this specific situation,  please post it. No more rants about criminals or cops rp quality. We are all trying to improve and do better for each other and the community.

 

Keep future posts to the topic and situation at hand.

 

So, from what I have gathered so far, the police were killed on sight & the Zetas involved believe they could kos a cop approaching them in a drug lab. Is that agreeable by both sides so far?

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I half agree with that. I am not sure if @waffels852 or @xxStallingCoinxx can say the same. I'd also like to emphasize that I was VDMed (if I remember correctly it was before I even had my weapon out).

 

Again, we were not approaching any of these people in the drug lab, we had just finished an off-road pursuit and were on the road of the drug lab moving away from it. The black vehicle was heading TOWARDS the drug lab, they were not at it. Myself and Miles Townsend drove past the black vehicle, Jordan Baxtor was a few seconds behind us. Baxtor then reported the black vehicle's presence in over the radio and was subsequently killed. He did not ask for backup, he merely reported that the vehicle was approaching the drug lab.

Edited by Denise C

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19 minutes ago, BallinByNature said:

So, from what I have gathered so far, the police were killed on sight & the Zetas involved believe they could kos a cop approaching them in a drug lab. Is that agreeable by both sides so far?

No. We did not kill any cop on sight.

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34 minutes ago, BallinByNature said:

Why was Baxtor killed after reporting a black vehicle? Was there any roleplay involved in his killing or was he just shot while in his vehicle?

There was no roleplay in any of our deaths from my understanding. I was rammed, ragdolled, then KOSed. @Denise C was immediately VDMed with the ram that ragdolled me.

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On 11/5/2018 at 3:03 AM, waffels852 said:

los zetas were blocking the road and had hopped out and immediately killed myself (Jordan Baxtor)

 

On 11/5/2018 at 3:03 AM, waffels852 said:

They gave us no chance to rp no chance to talk or anything

 

On 11/5/2018 at 3:03 AM, waffels852 said:

As police we should have a active presence on scenes, instead we have to deal with people who shoot us at first sight for aboslutely no reason, they had no KOS on any of us and instead decided to immediately shoot for no reason.

Yeah uhm so those claims are all invalid, what are you even saying? Roleplay was involved, @waffels852 decided to take off and ram Sasha. Which, gave us a great reason to kill Baxtor. 😊

 

Edited by Lunaa

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Yes ram him, while driving off and he moves towards the vehicle, or barely gets clipped by a side panel, also I enjoy the rp of immediately taking an ak and having it immediately. We in pd have to rp taking weapons out, why is it not the same for criminals, minus that where's the rp involved in trying to rob me? I had no interaction with any of you in easily the past 24 hours to this incident unless you wanna bring up the multiple shootouts beforehand, it's almost a daily occurrence that PD has multiple DM's and then we have people spamming our pm's in game, as well as over discord about all this stuff that we do, it's kind of hard to have good rp with people who show absolutely no fear, and have no respect for rping, let alone wanting to rp. That is the final message I have to say about this entire thing, unless requested for more info by Ballin.

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3 hours ago, BallinByNature said:

No more rants about criminals or cops rp quality. We are all trying to improve and do better for each other and the community.

 

Keep future posts to the topic and situation at hand.

@waffels852 btw

 

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5 hours ago, Lunaa said:

 

 

Yeah uhm so those claims are all invalid, what are you even saying? Roleplay was involved, @waffels852 decided to take off and ram Sasha. Which, gave us a great reason to kill Baxtor. 😊

 

Do you have footage of all of the kills?

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I don't have footage of all the kills, that's why I been asking Helene, Miles and Baxtor if they got evidence of what happened. Either way, we didn't DM, or break any rules. To me, this seems like just another report from PD after they don't get what they want.

On 11/7/2018 at 2:19 AM, Denise C said:

I'm not really understanding what I need evidence for.

Also, since you don't know what you need evidence for, @Denise C, might wanna take a look at the link you posted for someone else.

What constitutes as evidence?

  • Evidence is always required. Other players confirmations are not considered evidence. Posting "I saw it happen too." or "I can confirm this is the truth." without additional relevant evidence to the report is forbidden and may result in a forum warning.
  • Evidence of the rule breach is required such as a screenshot or video. Evidence from other players may be used and it is permitted for that player to post concrete evidence for you, again being a witness does not count.
2 hours ago, Denise C said:

Please be sure to visit this topic whenever you have the chance: 

 

Edited by Lunaa

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