Jack_Mccoy [ID 148] - NRP, NVL

[DrBeelz]

Player(s) being reported: 148
Date of interaction reported: 12/May/2022.
Unix time stamp from HUD: 1652312648

Your character name: Jack Betts
Other player(s) involved: 9

Specific rule(s) broken:
NRP - Ignoring Roleplay, NVL

 

How did the player break the rule(s)?  (300 words maximum)\
After one of our places got robbed we were informed that the Irish was the ones who had done it and so we went to Steamboat to check  to see who was there and we saw 3 people on top wearing green so me and my friend went down the road and parked up to a building with a ladder they followed us up my friend got out but I was stuck up there as I saw ID 148 and 9 proceed up the ladder I decided instead of just shooting at the ID 9 that first came up the ladder which would have been easy considering the ladder has a fixed position I would hold ID 9 hostage and so ID 9 dropped his aim but that's when ID 148 came up the ladder and started shooting ignoring his friend and risked his safety of which after shooting me I did get one bullet off so his friends life was in danger for sure. this stopped all RP and showed how ID 148 doesn't care for his friends life and went for the winning mentality over a RP situation that could've developed. I do not have footage of the shooting but told both of the players to save POV in pm and given the reason to why. my POV only started once I was downed as I had my shadowplay off. With the frisk request I didn't see it till I typed it out so didn't mean to pm when I should've been Rping that was my tunnel vision on focusing what I was typing in the message.

Evidence of rule breach
https://streamable.com/jz3z0p

[Arrta]

PENDING REVIEW
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Hi there! Thank you for submitting this player report.

This report will now be pending review by myself. During this time, we ask that you please refrain from any back-and-forth in this report between anyone involved.

Regards,
Senior Moderator Arrta

[mills]

PENDING RESPONSE

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After reviewing this report and the evidence attached to it, we have decided that this report cannot be concluded at this time. We would like to receive a response from the following player(s) to explain their side of the story:

• @cedridge Jack_Mccoy [148] -  Please explain your point of view in regard to this reported situation and provide any video evidence you may have.

• @STE Stephen_Joyce [9] - Please explain your point of view in regard to this reported situation and provide any video evidence you may have.

If the requested player(s) do not respond within (24) hours, this report will be concluded based on the evidence that has already been provided, to the best of our ability. 

Regards,

Senior Support Mills

Senior Support Waryerz

Senior Moderator Arrta

[STE]

Hi, ID 9 here. 

First off thank you for taking this report.

I want to start off by saying, I apologise for such a short POV. I clipped this part last night and uploaded it and now I am away with work so do not have access to the rest of it right now, I can get a longer POV at a later date if it is needed but I think this will show enough. I will try my best to explain the leadup to the clip too.

So I was on my way to Steamboat with Jack_Mccoy to meet with Eoghan_Macc when Eoghan called out that there was a 2 deep cream issy driving around, by the time I got to vespucci I saw that it was parked up and empty so I knew they had got out on foot and assumed it was on the roof, so I got out with Jack and had a look. One of them got off the roof and headed for the Issi, he spoke to us briefly and I recognised that it was Brodie_King, A person who we had just robbed a chop shop off, about an hour before this so I knew straight away they were here trying to catch us lacking and to get some revenge on us, knowing that he was alone on the roof, me and Jack climbed the ladder. When I got to the top of the ladder, I had my gun out and facing the reporting party so I could have, in theory, just shot at him. But instead I decided to listen to his demands for a couple of seconds to allow my friend to come up behind me so I was less likely to get shot, As soon as my friend got to the top and shot I rolled out of the line of fire and shot also. In the end neither of us even got hit once and we dealt with the reporting party quickly and safely. On top of this, we had around 10 people on freq and around the area so I knew the Issi could not make an attempt to follow us back up the ladder. 

I don't want to make any accusations but I would like to point out something I find strange in the reporting parties POV, At around 0:09 he can be heard pressing some sort of discord push to talk key and saying "Do not come back". Also at the time stamp between 2:30 and 2:55 he appears to be talking to someone. 

If you have any other questions let me know. 

Here is my POV: https://streamable.com/rj0ghl

[cedridge]

Hello, Jack Mccoy here

Stephen pretty much summed it all up in his reply, however I would like to give my side of the story too. When Stephen came up the ladder he had his gun out and was facing you, but to reduce the chances of himself being shot he "complied" with your demands, until I came up and shot you 3 times before you even realized what was going on. After realizing you are being shot you rolled and couldn't even get a bullet off (at least not one that I could see or hear in either mine or Stephen's POVs), that on its own shows how much "danger" Stephen really was.

Had the situation been slightly different, for example, Stephen was on his knees, you were behind him, or were making active demands to myself in return for his life, I would have approached the situation completely differently and actually used other means to get Stephen out of that situation instead of simply shooting you when from my thought process you didn't even have a clue I had gotten onto the roof at that point. I saw Stephen with a gun in his hand and under previous rulings I've seen he isn't considered to be under fear RP either, as he can return fire since the gun was in his hand and he was facing you.

I just want to reiterate one last time if circumstances had been different. For example Stephen had no gun in his hand and wasn't facing you or you had put Stephen between myself and you this would have been a completely different situation and played out as so.

 

 

[Waryerz]

PENDING RESPONSE
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After reviewing this report and the evidence attached to it, we have decided that this report cannot be concluded at this time. We would like to receive a response from the following player(s) to explain their side of the story:

• [@DrBeelz] - Jack_Betts [138] - Please explain the following:
  • Who were you in a discord call with during this incident? 
  • Could the person/people in your discord call hear you during this incident?
  • At 00:09 in the footage you provided, you can be heard saying "Do not come back." What was meant by this?
  • At 02:30 in the footage you provided, you can be heard talking but not ingame. What was the reasoning behind this?

If the requested player(s) do not respond within (24) hours, this report will be concluded based on the evidence that has already been provided, to the best of our ability.

Best Regards,
Arrta, Waryerz, & Mills

[DrBeelz]

ill be happy to explain all questions stated.

Who were you in a discord call with during this incident? I was not in a call with anyone.

 

Could the person/people in your discord call hear you during this incident? As stated before I was not in a call with anyone I don't know where at anytime in the video it shows I'm in a call with anyone. if you're on about the bleeps its my M key its my push to mute button on discord as I used to stream Dead by Daylight and when I want to talk to my chat I press M for mute so it doesn't interrupt my friends. if you re watch my POV you can see it only bleeps when I press M

 

At 00:09 in the footage you provided, you can be heard saying "Do not come back." What was meant by this? When I heard someone coming up the ladder I didn't know who it was and thought it was my friend coming back to save me but as seen in the video its another Irish gang member I say this OOC as its not something to say in character while bleeding heavily from gunshots.

 

At 02:30 in the footage you provided, you can be heard talking but not ingame. What was the reasoning behind this? Well when I'm stressed I talk to myself and on this night I had just finished a 13 hour shift to get back to find out 230k worth of equipment is gone that with my schedule takes a week to acquire and just wanted to at least have some fun RP while holding my first ever hostage and having some negotiations but as ID 148 ignored my gun pointed at his friend I was annoyed as I couldn't even get some fun RP and talking to myself was the only thing keeping me calm also saying these things are not something my character would say while bleeding out.

As a side note I know ID 148 said his friend still had his gun out so he knew that he could kill me before I could pull the trigger and that's only because you know the game mechanics require at least 3-4 shots to kill but you are suppose to treat it as 1 shot can kill your friend as its abusing game mechanics as you know it doesn't matter if I land 2 bullets in your friend you'll just go to pillbox and forget about it. its not healthy RP imagine PD doing the same as they outnumber most criminals with the same logic you would never be able to take a hostage and that's why they don't shoot even though they probably can and you shouldn't too. it doesn't matter if your friend is on his knees or hands up as long as a gun is pointed at his head you should have the mentality if I shoot one bullet and it lands you have lost a gang member.

this is my first report and I have 275k exp so I don't report easily and I'm sorry if I seemed very argumentative in my response in the last part I'm normally a lot more chill again I've just finished a 12 hour shift after writing this so I am sorry for that I just have to reiterate the last part however I do stand by what I said.

Thank you for taking the time to take this report.

Edited May 13, 2022 by DrBeelz

[Arrta]

REPORT DENIED
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After our deliberations, we’ve concluded that this report will be denied for the following reason(s):

• FearRP applies to your character not to someone else's.

In the supplied evidence we can observe Stephen_Joyce (9) climb the ladder and be placed under fear immediately after getting to the top. Obeying the commands issued to him he stopped and did not turn to attack until his ally arrived and opened fire first.

Jack_McCoy (148), who was behind him is not required to fear for his allies life and reacted similar to how any criminal might react. If someone is observed to have an ally at gun point, they need to be taken out.

Finally, this ended up being a 2v1 scenario and the angles did not benefit you so that you could attempt to place both under fear at once. Stephen moved away from the ladder which left room for his ally to arrive and take action against you without placing himself at risk. And, once you turned to Jack, Stephen was open to attack you as well.

This decision is final. Unless instructed to, if you post another player report pertaining to this incident, you may be muted from posting on the forums for a temporary period. If you disagree with the outcome of this report, please file an appeal following the appeal guidelines and format. This will now be locked and archived.

Regards,
Senior Moderator Arrta & Senior Support Wayers & mills